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Fire Murray?
Fire Murray 40%  40%  [ 16 ]
Fire Murray 5%  5%  [ 2 ]
Aode is a Tool 48%  48%  [ 19 ]
Fire Murray 8%  8%  [ 3 ]
Total votes : 40
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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 8:46 pm 
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northwest dave wrote:
Ace wrote:
The organization needs to realize that Crombeen and Winchester aren't NHL players first.


Winchester yes, but Crombeen has been part of the PK crew which was the only reason we got a tie today.


Key word there is today. Hasn't the PK been mediocre this year? Crombeen isn't an important piece to the PK IMHO either way.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:00 pm 
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Nyghtewynd wrote:
BF44 wrote:
In the last two games, the Blues have done everything right except in one area... putting the puck in the net. All of the coaching, instruction, drilling and bag skating in the WORLD isn't going to teach shooters how to hit the target.

Andy Murray didn't let one in from teh blue line today. Andy Murray didn't keep hitting Hedberg in the crest with pucks. Andy Murray didn't miss by 2 feet in teh shootout........

:doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:


Using this logic, JD should offer Murray a lifetime contract.

:letsgoblues:

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:12 pm 
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Ace wrote:
northwest dave wrote:
Ace wrote:
The organization needs to realize that Crombeen and Winchester aren't NHL players first.


Winchester yes, but Crombeen has been part of the PK crew which was the only reason we got a tie today.


Key word there is today. Hasn't the PK been mediocre this year? Crombeen isn't an important piece to the PK IMHO either way.


PK has been top 10 in the NHL thus far.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:14 pm 
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The question is who replaces Murray? And, no, Al MacInnis isn't the right answer.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:21 pm 
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I say you see what happens over this long homestand, if we still have only won 1 game at home by the end of it then, I think you need to get rid of him.

And I don't know that I would lump Crombeen in with Winchester, at least Crombeen is still pretty young, while Winchester is like what? 28-29?

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:31 pm 
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About the best thing I can say in his defense is something that's already been touched on- the blues aren't getting rocked out there.

Even if its the goaltending more than the defense- the Blues are still not getting killed and they should have won tonight if not for the fluky bounces.

I understand the frustration and I don't think the start to this season is what any of us had in mind, but at the same time I think its still too early to fire Murray. As for the "threshold of the level of suck" required to can him, I don't think there's a clear answer to that. I would say by Decemberish if the Blues are still clawing for points he should be let go. IMO

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:43 pm 
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[quote="BF44"]In the last two games, the Blues have done everything right except in one area... putting the puck in the net. All of the coaching, instruction, drilling and bag skating in the WORLD isn't going to teach shooters how to hit the target.

Andy Murray didn't let one in from teh blue line today. Andy Murray didn't keep hitting Hedberg in the crest with pucks. Andy Murray didn't miss by 2 feet in teh shootout........

:doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh: :doh:[/quote]

But Murray IS the coach who wants BOTH King and Janssen on his NHL roster, rather than Eller. After Eller was the BEST Blues' forward on the ice last night, Murray plays him 8.5 minutes (only 3 minutes more than Janssen-in a run of Games in which The Blues are scoring almost zilch. Eller played ZERO minutes in overtime (where a goal is needed to win). Crombeen playe 16.5 minutes, while Oshie, Berglund and Eller played less than 10. Pietrangelo helps the offence immensely. And although he makes a few mistakes (as all defencemen do (including Weaver, Colaiacovo, Sydor, Jackman and Brewer), Murray insists on overexposing their marginal "experienced D-men, while limiting Pietrangelo's minutes. There should not still be talk of sending Pietrangelo to uniors, or Eller to Peoria.

But, even more maddening than Murray's penchant for playing marginal career minor leaguers and slowed, aged over-the-hill veterans rather than young, talented rookies and 2nd year men, is his game strategy. He plays every game "not to lose", rather than to win. He tries to sit on one-goal and 2-goal leads for half a game. In overtime, -EVEN against Eastern teams, he place defence-first. The Blues will NEVER play with Killer Instinct with Murray at the helm. He is holding them down.

Kariya, Boyes,Tkachuk, McDonald, Brewer and Jackman are NOT the players that will lead The Blues to The Stanley Cup. Johnson, Pietrangelo, Rundblad, Cole, Eller, Oshie, Berglund, Perron, and maybe Backes are. Murray is not a coach to lead them to it. Let them get the NHL minutes they need to develop in decent time, while also changing the outlook and confidence of the team. Everyone should be having fun playing the game they love (not looking over their shoulders on every play worried they'll be benched for a little mistake. A player like Boyes should be benched if he's not backchecking or going full out to win battles for pucks or cover for his shiftmates. Accountability should be uniform.

I'd rather see what the kids can do (including Junland, maybe Strachan (a little), maybe a trial for Palushaj and Drazenovic), but certainly, more time for the 19-22 year olds already on the team. That won't happen at all, or the process will be strung out too long under Murray-and it will be more difficult to get a fun, winning atmosphere with Murry at the helm.

I was disappointed when he was rehired, and I'd like to see him replaced. I understand that it's early in the season, and his team did well last year. But, he's got to leave before The Blues take the next step, -so, the earlier the better. I know JD won't fire him until this season looks a lot worse. But, I think that is a mistake.


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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:49 pm 
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Well said. :plusplus:

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:52 pm 
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Ace wrote:
northwest dave wrote:
Ace wrote:
The organization needs to realize that Crombeen and Winchester aren't NHL players first.


Winchester yes, but Crombeen has been part of the PK crew which was the only reason we got a tie today.


Key word there is today. Hasn't the PK been mediocre this year? Crombeen isn't an important piece to the PK IMHO either way.


Yes he has. Look at the stats for the couple of games, especially the past 4. Crombeen has been on PK for awhile now.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:25 pm 
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If Andy Murray is unwilling to admit and correct his power play coaching (27th) and distribution of game minutes for young talent, then he should be held accountable for his position.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:27 pm 
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Murray is a good coach, but he seems to have a shelf life of about 2- 3 years tops where he is really getting the best out of the team. I'm not a fan of changing coaches midseason, but I don't follow the Blues closely. How is Murray with the young players? The Blues have a real nice young core and these kids need to continue to improve to take the team to the next level. I'm not sure if Andy is the guy that can grow with the kids though.

The season is only 15 games young , so I'd give Murray another month before I would panic. That said ,the West is tight this year and points look a little harder to come by with the improvements in Colorado and Dallas. Hopefully the Blues serve up another stinker on Tuesday because Vancouver needs all the help it can get right now with all of the injuries.


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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 10:47 pm 
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BF44 wrote:
In the last two games, the Blues have done everything right except in one area... putting the puck in the net.

Unless a team is having an off night, the Blues will never excel in that area under Andy Murray. Plain and simple, with or without Murray, this team needs a new system catered to the skill of the players.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 11:15 pm 
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I like Murray, I really do....BUT my biggest fear with him at the helm is what if he is setting our rebuild back instead of moving it forward. What I mean is that with all the young prospects we have coming up what if his system stunts their growth and that sets the players potential ceiling back a couple clicks. Instead of some of our players becoming a Kane or Toews type offensive player, they become more of a 50-60 point forward and thats about as good as it gets with them. These playing years for our prospects are REAL important. I am a firm believer that some of the NHL's duds of the past decades could have been very good players if they were brought along right. I hope this post is coherent and reflects the point I am trying to make.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 11:36 pm 
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[quote="Jackman_the_Iceman"]I like Murray, I really do....BUT my biggest fear with him at the helm is what if he is setting our rebuild back instead of moving it forward. What I mean is that with all the young prospects we have coming up what if his system stunts their growth and that sets the players potential ceiling back a couple clicks. Instead of some of our players becoming a Kane or Toews type offensive player, they become more of a 50-60 point forward and thats about as good as it gets with them. These playing years for our prospects are REAL important. I am a firm believer that some of the NHL's duds of the past decades could have been very good players if they were brought along right. I hope this post is coherent and reflects the point I am trying to make.[/quote]

I don't think Murray's system can make Eller, Berglund or Oshie into 50-point players, when they would have otherwise progressed into 80-point players (unless he'll be their coach for their entire careers. But his way of choosing a roster, ice time, and his system could set their development back (e.g. cause them to take 1-2 years more to reach a certain level of play).


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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 11:51 pm 
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Jackman_the_Iceman wrote:
his system stunts their growth and that sets the players potential ceiling back

Save time writing blogs and long posts by summarizing your discontent with Murray's distribution of ice time for young players by using two simple words...


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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 08, 2009 11:54 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:04 am 
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OPTIMEGUS wrote:
If Andy Murray is unwilling to admit and correct his power play coaching (27th) and distribution of game minutes for young talent, then he should be held accountable for his position.


Ummm...did he not take Kariya off the PP unit and completely rearrange it??? And did he not play Eller in the last couple of games?? Eller wasn't that great today...he was ok, but he was not the same as he was against Philly.

The Blues have one of the youngest team right now. How do you bring up players who never stepped foot in the NHL and who do you put on waivers or trade. You just can't bring up a player and play them without removing another player. And if it doesn't work out, you are screwed.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:05 am 
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OPTIMEGUS wrote:
Jackman_the_Iceman wrote:
his system stunts their growth and that sets the players potential ceiling back

Save time writing blogs and long posts by summarizing your discontent with Murray's distribution of ice time for young players by using two simple words...


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:lol: What? Also let me say again, I like Murray and I wish him well. He is our coach right now so we better like him. I just stated one of my fears with him. I didn't say that it's happening but that it COULD happen.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:07 am 
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northwest dave wrote:
OPTIMEGUS wrote:
If Andy Murray is unwilling to admit and correct his power play coaching (27th) and distribution of game minutes for young talent, then he should be held accountable for his position.


Ummm...did he not take Kariya off the PP unit and completely rearrange it???


No, I didnt know, because I have Dish

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Last edited by Winning Unlimited on Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Fire Murray?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:07 am 
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northwest dave wrote:
OPTIMEGUS wrote:
If Andy Murray is unwilling to admit and correct his power play coaching (27th) and distribution of game minutes for young talent, then he should be held accountable for his position.


Ummm...did he not take Kariya off the PP unit and completely rearrange it???

so mad at dish, I posted twice

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Last edited by Winning Unlimited on Mon Nov 09, 2009 12:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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