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PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:07 am 
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It would be pretty hard for me to trade Jake Allen. Even ignoring the fact that it would probably be selling low (at least a little), I think Allen is our best bet for the playoffs.

Hutton has played really well, but it's only 19 starts. And it's not real common for a career backup to suddenly be a legit top goaltender at age 32. Maybe he is for real, but I'd like more than 19 starts before trading away the starter.

I'm happy we have Husso. And, I'm certainly not predicting him to flop. But, there's a lot of ambiguity about what he will be. A year or two ago, we were talking about Binnington pushing Allen out.

If we were to trade Allen, it would have to be for something big for an extended period. If it's Taveras for 8 years, sure, we can discuss that (even if we have to throw in more). But, I'm not letting Allen go for a rental or for anything less than a huge return.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:03 pm 
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Rangers talking about moving Rick Nash. Evidently he has submitted a list of 18 teams where he would refuse a trade. Haven't seen what's on it, though.

I would personally pass on Nash- based on his production the last couple years, I don't think he makes this team any better than it currently is, and he would be an expensive rental. And I'll always remember Oshie absolutely demolishing him a number of years ago, leading to his (Oshie's) unintentional run for mayor of St. Louis. :lol:

Other names floating around: Evander Kane, Pacioretty, Mike Hoffman. And Josh Leivo has requested to be traded out of Toronto.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:52 pm 
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Armstrong went on the record with "no rental" trades

Rick Nash - last year of contract = rental - nope
Evander Kane - last year of contract = rental - nope
Pacioretty - possibility, which I'm completely against given the Habs have had "leadership" issues the entire time he's been captain.
Mike Hoffman - possibility
Josh Leivo - possibility

Given what Leivo produces every time he plays, that's something I'd seriously consider.

The issue with both Hoffman and Pacioretty is salary cap. Hoffman is 5.6M. Pacioretty is 5M even. The Blues would have to clear over 4M in cap space to bring either on board - which would mean moving Stastny, Steen, Schwartz, Schenn, Berglund, Sobotka, or Bouwmeester. If it were Sobotka, they would have to move someone else, too. Even if the Sens or Habs were to keep some salary, the Blues still have to have the space within their own roster. And no way should the Habs or Sens eat salary to trade either of those players.

Leivo is under contract for another year and is an RFA after that... so... that would make some sense. Deal some of our defensive depth for Leivo and see how he fits in.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 1:19 pm 
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theohall wrote:
Armstrong went on the record with "no rental" trades

Rick Nash - last year of contract = rental - nope
Evander Kane - last year of contract = rental - nope
Pacioretty - possibility, which I'm completely against given the Habs have had "leadership" issues the entire time he's been captain.
Mike Hoffman - possibility
Josh Leivo - possibility

Given what Leivo produces every time he plays, that's something I'd seriously consider.

The issue with both Hoffman and Pacioretty is salary cap. Hoffman is 5.6M. Pacioretty is 5M even. The Blues would have to clear over 4M in cap space to bring either on board - which would mean moving Stastny, Steen, Schwartz, Schenn, Berglund, Sobotka, or Bouwmeester. If it were Sobotka, they would have to move someone else, too. Even if the Sens or Habs were to keep some salary, the Blues still have to have the space within their own roster. And no way should the Habs or Sens eat salary to trade either of those players.

Leivo is under contract for another year and is an RFA after that... so... that would make some sense. Deal some of our defensive depth for Leivo and see how he fits in.


Why is Hoffman even being shopped? Isn't he one of their better players under contract for a few more years? (edit: yes, 2 more years at $5.60).

But no, we wouldn't have to clear $5.6. Remember that Ottawa carries the cap salary for the year of the time he's played with them (IIRC) so the Blues would only have to cover about 3/4 of the cap hit, or very roughly $1.4 million this year, which according to NHLnumbers.com the Blues could nearly cover. If we assume we let Stastny and his $7 million walk this offseason then that clears the space for next year. Depends on what it would cost to get him obviously but in a vaccuum, I'd have him over. Sure.

HELL no to Rick Nash. He's basically done in this league. Another 2-3 years he'll be out. I wouldn't want him for free (well, maybe for free) on the fear he'll just eff up the chemistry of the team more than actually help, much less trade anything for him. That the Rangers think he'll command a good price return is laughable to me.

I just hope to God Armstrong means it when he says no rentals. We don't need that in our lives right now.

edit: Oh, and the Jake Allen trade talk? I'm sorry, but that's asinine. Do you guys not remember Brian Elliott? How soon we forget. Allen is a legit starter in this league. Hutton is on a temporary tear. That's all it is. HELL no do not trade The Snake.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:22 pm 
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I would trade Bouwmeester for Leivo yesterday. He's being totally misused in Toronto and could quietly slip in as a very productive offensive contributor.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 11:34 am 
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First significant movement of trade season?

LA Kings get: Dion Phaneuf, Nate Thompson

Ottawa gets: Marion Gaborik, Nick Shore

LA obviously making a move to try and help them get over the hump into one of the Wild Card spots.

No draft picks were swapped on this trade, which I found interesting. How often do you see that anymore? I wonder if that will set a precedent for other trades going forward. Probably not.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 14, 2018 1:13 pm 
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That's the Senators dumping salary again.

Next 3 years:
Gaborik 4.575 3.175 3.075
Phaneuf 6.500 6.500 5.500

Next year
Nick Shore .925
Nate Thompson 1.65

And Gaborik, at 35, might not even play out that contract.

Sens dropped 2.65M off next year's cap with that trade. And 3+ over the following 2 seasons.

Makes me think the Sens are serious about trying to keep Erik Karlsson.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:21 am 
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theohall wrote:
That's the Senators dumping salary again.

Next 3 years:
Gaborik 4.575 3.175 3.075
Phaneuf 6.500 6.500 5.500

Next year
Nick Shore .925
Nate Thompson 1.65

And Gaborik, at 35, might not even play out that contract.

Sens dropped 2.65M off next year's cap with that trade. And 3+ over the following 2 seasons.

Makes me think the Sens are serious about trying to keep Erik Karlsson.


Seeing reports Ottawa retained 25% of Phanuef's salary so it's not quite the outright win that it looked like at first blush but they're still saving salary.

There's so many garbage long term contracts in this league it's ridiculous. GM's keep losing their minds and eating it year after year. If I was Arizona or Vegas I'd try to work that misfortune to get more picks and prospects. I think Gaborik is done and Dion is about to be. You don't even have to play these guys, just take the contracts.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:07 am 
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Tage Thompson sent back to San Antonio.

So the current crew keeps not getting it done with Thomspon out of the lineup. So, send him down and keep playing the guys who don't play for a full 60. Brilliant!!!

NHL Tonight guys suggested Blues could acquire Patrick Maroon... Problem is they prospects they listed... Thank goodness Brian Bellows mentioned the whole Ryan Miller fiasco and how the Blues might not necessarily want to give up prospects for something now.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:26 pm 
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Aside from that small potatoes trade with the Maple Leafs, I don't think Army will actually do anything. The team is in a holding pattern until Fabbri and Sanford are back and a bunch of the kids are ready to come in. I'm not entirely sure they want to make a run this year given what kind of offensive help is on the way.

I worry that Yeo will screw up the kids the same way Andy Murray screwed up his batch. David Perron, in particular, would probably have been a way better player if he hadn't been so suffocated by Skeltor... that and the concussion.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 5:41 pm 
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I'm not even counting Sanford as one of the 22 for next season.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:44 pm 
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glen a richter wrote:
Aside from that small potatoes trade with the Maple Leafs, I don't think Army will actually do anything. The team is in a holding pattern until Fabbri and Sanford are back and a bunch of the kids are ready to come in. I'm not entirely sure they want to make a run this year given what kind of offensive help is on the way.

I worry that Yeo will screw up the kids the same way Andy Murray screwed up his batch. David Perron, in particular, would probably have been a way better player if he hadn't been so suffocated by Skeltor... that and the concussion.


Regardless of whatever kids we have in the pipeline, Tarasenko, Schwartz and Pietrangelo aren't getting any younger here, especially Pietro. We don't have a first rounder this year. The run is now. And every year until those Big 3 can't carry the mail any more.

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:53 pm 
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Interesting read below, from https://www.stlouisgametime.com/2018/2/19/17029252/seven-years-later-a-familiar-storm-brews

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Like most people, I was asleep the last time the St. Louis Blues made a trade that truly altered the trajectory of the franchise. Seven years ago today, Erik Johnson and Jay McClement left for the Colorado Avalanche. Chris Stewart and Kevin Shattenkirk formed the main part of the return, and the door was closed on a rebuilding process that began with the miserable 2005-06 season.

I went searching for my initial Twitter reaction to the deal, and was pleasantly surprised to find I was circumspect:
Going to take a long while to digest this one. First reaction? Shock. Second? I like it a lot. Got deeper. It's a new team.

That tweet was sent at 8:35 AM. In Jeremy Rutherford’s story on stltoday.com from that day, he mentions receiving a text of reaction from Johnson at 2:40 AM. The Blues played in Buffalo the previous night and informed the players involved that they had been dealt upon touching down at the airport in St. Louis.

Quietly and in the middle of the night, Armstrong and the Blues management team changed the course of the franchise. At the time of the trade, the Blues were in last place. They were 26-21-9 and in the process of selling off rental pieces. Team captain and scapegoat Eric Brewer was traded to Tampa Bay on the afternoon of February 18th, and less than 18 hours later, Johnson, the only first overall draft selection in team history, was gone as well.

I mention this because the present incarnation of the Blues may be facing similar turmoil. Two years prior to the trade with the Avalanche, the team made a surprising run to the playoffs that wasn’t matched in the following seasons. Davis Payne took over as head coach halfway through the 2009-10 season, and a year later, the shake up happened. If we imagine the progress of the franchise on a bell curve, they were trending up but stalled. The Colorado trade was an attempt to push them forward again.

Today’s Blues may be on the other side of the curve. That 2010-11 season was the last one in which the Blues failed to qualify for the playoffs. This season is at risk of being the next. The Blues currently sit in the top wild card spot in the Western Conference. They’re four points ahead of the Calgary Flames, which is the top team not currently holding a playoff spot. The Flames do have one game in hand, however, which theoretically cuts further into the safety of the standings.

Jeremy Rutherford is now with The Athletic, and released a mailbag this week (subscription required) in which he expressed some unusually pointed criticisms of the team.

“Every May,” he wrote, “I see a despondent group of players and every October-April I see the same group making the same mistakes and excuses.”

Rutherford went on to mention that some players may be wary of Vladimir Tarasenko’s work ethic, and delivered this rebuke which was stronger than any I can remember reading from him in recent years:

“Guys are just playing hockey, many of them not playing FOR EACH OTHER. And I haven’t even mentioned the guys who are just playing for the paycheck or the lifestyle, which in this case I’m not going to name names, but they know who they are.”

That’s an alarming passage to read from a reporter who has been around the team nearly every day for more than a decade, and it seems to bring a problem of locker room culture into sharp relief.

It’s often said that it’s easier to fire the coach than the players, but like Payne seven years ago, Mike Yeo hasn’t been given sufficient time to seize control of the team and shape it to his specifications. And, like Payne, Yeo may be saddled with disappointing players who are unwilling or unable to fit their square pegs into round holes.

Players like Patrik Berglund and Vladimir Sobotka have been widely discussed as being available on the trade market, which calls into question the wisdom in signing each to long term contracts as recently as last spring. Still, trading neither of those players would offer the kind of core shakeup that the Blues felt was necessary in the run up to the Johnson deal.

I don’t expect to wake up early some morning in the next week to discover that Tarasenko has been traded or that Alex Pietrangelo is packing his bags. However, I also don’t expect Doug Armstrong to be content with a plateau that may soon become a cliff.

The winds of change will sweep through the Blues roster, and they’ll come soon. Failing that, the summer may grow unbearably long.


Maybe we won't have such a quiet trade deadline after all.

But I wouldn't count on it.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:43 am 
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Berglund is the epitome of playing for a pay-check right now. By this I mean not trying to earn one, but just collect one.

Sobotka drives me nuts. When he's playing in the top 6, you see the effort. When he's playing center on the 3rd line, you see the effort. As soon as he goes to the wing on that 3rd line, it becomes so-so.

Tarasenko - get him off the damn point on the power play.
Schwartz - get him off the damn point on the power play.
(this seems to rotate)

But - Yeo is a player's coach and it seems that's what Tarasenko wants.

Both of them do more and are more effective when they aren't trying to be power play QBs. The Blues have enough talented d-men, even with Edmundson out, to use only defenseman on both units. Bouwmeester did this very effectively from the left-side when with Florida and Calgary. No reason he couldn't do it again, but we will never see this happen. Too much infatuation with 4 forward, rookie defenseman unit, which keeps giving up shorties and short-handed chances.

Defensively, I can't say any of the d-men are just going through the motions. Even Bouwmeester is showing the effort. He's just not as spry as he once was and is apparently not 100% from his injury.

Were I GM, Sundqvist gone. Sanford hasn't earned anything, so play in San Antonio until he has earned a spot, like is being asked of all of the other younger players. So what if he is 23 and was part of the Shattenkirk trade. Jaskin is a fine 4th line player, but the coach, just like Hitchcock, seems to think Jaskin is an answer for the top line, which he isn't. Force the coaches hand by having Thompson and Blais on the roster and removing these grinders. But - that's not the Blues way apparently. Instead, we will get to enjoy the mucking and grinding which doesn't win in today's game. Heck, not even Wade Megan got a fair shake. 1 game in which he barely played? Was supposed to get a second one, but was scratched for Sundvqist because "Megan doesn't kill penalties" even though he has regularly killed penalties for Chicago. Why not put together a line of Blais/Megan/Thompson? It's not like they would be any worse than Sobotka/Berglund/insert player x. Oh - that would mean not playing big grinding forwards who lack skill. :roll:

This while earn your spot thing is one of the things I really enjoy about watching the Lightning. If you stop producing, you are going to move to a different line, and if that doesn't work, you will be moved out in favor of someone working at their AHL club.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 9:24 am 
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Sobotka has the skill. When he stepped in last year from the K we all saw it more or less immediately. He was a spark plug for the group and some of his shots were straight nasty.

For whatever reason on a full season schedule just haven't been seeing it. God I miss Fabbri. This year wouldn't be so nerve wracking if we had him healthy.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 12:36 pm 
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Sobotka is just inconsistent night to night. This is why I was saying when he was on that tear at the beginning of the season to just wait and see. Career numbers over an extended period of time are more indicative of what a player will do than what one sees over a few weeks. Unless they have significantly changed their game. It looked like Sobotka had, but then reverted when - like everyone else - stopped producing results when paired with Berglund.

Berglund needs to go.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:26 pm 
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A couple of moves today... Petr Mrazek traded to the Flyers and Nick Holden traded to the Bruins.

Minor trickles leading to a big rush I think. Not necessarily that the Blues will be in, but that I think deadline day is going to be busy in general.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 20, 2018 6:27 pm 
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Had Neuvirth not gotten injured, I doubt the Flyers make that trade. But both Elliott and Neuvirth are out with injuries.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:44 pm 
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might be a bit more of a buyers market than is usual

if so, the Blues should try to jump start the transition of their core. No to rentals but a piece of value with some years of control remaining would be good. Since ownership is enamored with Army, I guess we can hope the Schenn trade is a sign of things to come.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 21, 2018 7:04 pm 
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If Doug can get one or more of his mistakes (21, 71, 20) off the books, I'll be happy. That is, I'll be as happy as a fan of this team can be.

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