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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 8:01 am 
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JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
What happened to DaDitka? He hasn't posted all year!

As far as the Rams go is it really worth spending close to a BILLION dollars for just 8 home games a year?? I really don't care if they split and I know plenty of people agree with me!


It's not just 8 games.

St. Louis would try to get an MLS team (I know, you're excited!). It would host concerts, they'd probably try to get a Mizzou-Illini football game there every year, etc. It would also, at least from Bernie's article, be a part of a wider development of stores, restaurants, etc. too.

Also, STL isn't going to fit the bill for a billion dollars. The G-4 fund in the NFL allows the NFL/franchise to chip in up to 400-500 million bucks if I read that right.

Also, you lose the Rams, you lose the chance to overhaul that north side of downtown near the river and that entire area would continue to deteriorate. Letting them split would do more harm than you are letting on.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 9:32 am 
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dmiles2186 wrote:
JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
What happened to DaDitka? He hasn't posted all year!

As far as the Rams go is it really worth spending close to a BILLION dollars for just 8 home games a year?? I really don't care if they split and I know plenty of people agree with me!


It's not just 8 games.

St. Louis would try to get an MLS team (I know, you're excited!). It would host concerts, they'd probably try to get a Mizzou-Illini football game there every year, etc. It would also, at least from Bernie's article, be a part of a wider development of stores, restaurants, etc. too.

Also, STL isn't going to fit the bill for a billion dollars. The G-4 fund in the NFL allows the NFL/franchise to chip in up to 400-500 million bucks if I read that right.

Also, you lose the Rams, you lose the chance to overhaul that north side of downtown near the river and that entire area would continue to deteriorate. Letting them split would do more harm than you are letting on.


Agreed.
The city needs to do everything in their power to keep the Rams here.
It's not just 8 home games. Dumb comment JNE.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 11:07 am 
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How do you guys explain a city like Portland which is growing FASTER than St.Louis without an NFL team? Plus the dome we have now is just fine for conventions and college ball. I've been to conventions there and it's just fine.

MLS can get a soccer specific stadium that holds 20K. A cavernous 60K stadium is way too big for MLS. I'm doubtful St.Louis will ever get an MLS team anyway. Even if they do I question if they would get long term support to make it viable.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 11:43 am 
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JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
How do you guys explain a city like Portland which is growing FASTER than St.Louis without an NFL team? Plus the dome we have now is just fine for conventions and college ball. I've been to conventions there and it's just fine.

MLS can get a soccer specific stadium that holds 20K. A cavernous 60K stadium is way too big for MLS. I'm doubtful St.Louis will ever get an MLS team anyway. Even if they do I question if they would get long term support to make it viable.


Portland has other things going for it. It's a strange city and I mean that in a good way. It's artsy, and the music and culture there is much more diverse than in St. Louis. There is a pull to that city being different and unique, whereas St. Louis is just this drab city in the middle of the country that is losing business and industry. I say that as an outsider, I'm just comparing what I know of the two cities.

You can build a football stadium so that it can seat soccer teams (see: Seattle) so that it doesn't seem like a deserted venue (see: New England). I question the support that an STL MLS will get as well, and this is coming from a soccer fan hoping the city gets a team. There's a lot of people that I've heard and seen online that have said, 'If the city gets an MLS team, I will go.' But I also feel like they should prove their worth and support the new USL-Pro team.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 11:54 am 
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Short term I can see MLS succeeding here but not long term. MLS gets ZERO national press which helps the draw of other sports. It's true the NHL doesn't get much national press BUT pro hockey leagues have been around in America for a century. You can't say the same for soccer.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 2:24 pm 
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I've been to St. Louis. Y'all need whatever you can get to keep certain parts of the city from deteriorating any worse than they already are. The ride on the Metrolink from Lambert to the hotel reminded me of some of the more drab parts of the Bronx. I don't like the Rams, but it's crucial they don't leave. This stadium plan is just what the doctor ordered. Let LA take the Raiders back instead.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 5:25 pm 
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They want 2 teams in LA. The Rams and Raiders because the Chargers announced they announced they are staying. The Rams and Raiders used to be in LA remember?

Even if the Lambs...err Rams move I still think St.Louis has a good chance to land the Jaguars eventually. We CAN live without the NFL for a while or even for good!


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 7:02 pm 
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JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
They want 2 teams in LA. The Rams and Raiders because the Chargers announced they announced they are staying. The Rams and Raiders used to be in LA remember?

Even if the Lambs...err Rams move I still think St.Louis has a good chance to land the Jaguars eventually. We CAN live without the NFL for a while or even for good!


The Chargers announced they are staying..next year. They didn't commit to 2016 and beyond.

I disagree...with the reputation STL has right now, if you lose another football team in the biggest sports league in the world? What does it say about you? Nothing good.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2014 9:51 pm 
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But then we would be the largest market without an NFL team.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 12:36 am 
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JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
But then we would be the largest market without an NFL team.


Someone has to be.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 12:43 am 
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Some say this Ferguson mess could hurt St.Louis for DECADES to come. I don't see that but I suppose it could hurt us in some ways. It seems enrollment at UMSL is down and so is tourism.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 9:20 am 
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JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
Some say this Ferguson mess could hurt St.Louis for DECADES to come. I don't see that but I suppose it could hurt us in some ways. It seems enrollment at UMSL is down and so is tourism.


Who is saying that?

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 9:23 am 
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I'm somewhat conflicted on the stadium thing. I hate government-funded stadiums. But I guess I hate the idea of the Rams leaving even more. I don't know what's to think at this point. At least we have another year.

Not sure how much impact this has, but apparently the announcers in the Giants game this weekend commented about being surprised at how full the dome was given how bad the Rams have been for a decade.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2014 11:10 am 
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cardsfan04 wrote:
JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
Some say this Ferguson mess could hurt St.Louis for DECADES to come. I don't see that but I suppose it could hurt us in some ways. It seems enrollment at UMSL is down and so is tourism.


Who is saying that?


The local media. Watch Donnybrook on Channel 9 on Thursday nights.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 25, 2014 8:08 am 
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cardsfan04 wrote:
Not sure how much impact this has, but apparently the announcers in the Giants game this weekend commented about being surprised at how full the dome was given how bad the Rams have been for a decade.


This is one of the things that has annoyed me at the perception of the Rams' attendance problems. No, they aren't selling out, and they've got empty seats week in and week out, but to draw 55-60,000 each week (in a 66,000 seat stadium), is pretty impressive for as godawful as they've been. People act like STL doesn't support the Rams. It's not true at all. There are a lot of Rams fans and I'm guessing there are more waiting to 'come back' once the team shows some competency on the field.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 25, 2014 9:01 am 
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dmiles2186 wrote:
cardsfan04 wrote:
Not sure how much impact this has, but apparently the announcers in the Giants game this weekend commented about being surprised at how full the dome was given how bad the Rams have been for a decade.


This is one of the things that has annoyed me at the perception of the Rams' attendance problems. No, they aren't selling out, and they've got empty seats week in and week out, but to draw 55-60,000 each week (in a 66,000 seat stadium), is pretty impressive for as godawful as they've been. People act like STL doesn't support the Rams. It's not true at all. There are a lot of Rams fans and I'm guessing there are more waiting to 'come back' once the team shows some competency on the field.


Completely agree. They've been here 20 years, so they don't have generations of tradition that gets unconditional support. And they've been awful for like 17 of those years. Not just any kind of awful either. They've had the worst 5-year run in sports history. Approximately every city would have similar amounts of empty seats.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 28, 2014 9:46 pm 
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With the way the thing is put together, the only draw is really the stadium... you go down and watch the game, you leave. These plans aren't going to fix the problem and really just throw good money after bad, imo.

Football is about tailgating and fan experience. STL's sucks hard on both accounts. Your fans are boring...and some of it is the legacy of the f ing PSLs they sold when the team opened the dome. It kept out good people who you need to have buying tickets to sustain a franchise.

Follow all that up with lots of on-field suck and you have what you have.

The team is leaving no matter how much money you throw at the problem... it's really about how long you want to delay the leaving and how much you want to spend to do it.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 29, 2014 4:15 am 
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not_a_wings_fan wrote:
With the way the thing is put together, the only draw is really the stadium... you go down and watch the game, you leave. These plans aren't going to fix the problem and really just throw good money after bad, imo.

Football is about tailgating and fan experience. STL's sucks hard on both accounts. Your fans are boring...and some of it is the legacy of the f ing PSLs they sold when the team opened the dome. It kept out good people who you need to have buying tickets to sustain a franchise.

Follow all that up with lots of on-field suck and you have what you have.

The team is leaving no matter how much money you throw at the problem... it's really about how long you want to delay the leaving and how much you want to spend to do it.


LOL...is this Ray Hartman? He is the local scribe on Donnybrook who says the Rams are already gone! He says if Kroenke really wants to move there's nothing St.Louis can do about it!


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 29, 2014 12:18 pm 
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JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
not_a_wings_fan wrote:
With the way the thing is put together, the only draw is really the stadium... you go down and watch the game, you leave. These plans aren't going to fix the problem and really just throw good money after bad, imo.

Football is about tailgating and fan experience. STL's sucks hard on both accounts. Your fans are boring...and some of it is the legacy of the f ing PSLs they sold when the team opened the dome. It kept out good people who you need to have buying tickets to sustain a franchise.

Follow all that up with lots of on-field suck and you have what you have.

The team is leaving no matter how much money you throw at the problem... it's really about how long you want to delay the leaving and how much you want to spend to do it.


LOL...is this Ray Hartman? He is the local scribe on Donnybrook who says the Rams are already gone! He says if Kroenke really wants to move there's nothing St.Louis can do about it!


That's not 100% true.
A move has to be approved by the league's owners in a vote. Plus it needs the blessing of the commissioner.
If Kroenke wants to move the team, it just makes it harder for St. Louis to keep them.
St. Louis can most definitely keep the Rams. They just need to put together a killer stadium plan...which may not be financially responsible, but they can still do it and keep the Rams.

I have never liked Kroenke.
I wish Khan or whatever his name was, would have been allowed to buy the Rams back when he thought he had. I doubt we'd be having these discussions now.

Kroenke is a billionaire. Does he really have to move the team to LA to make money on this deal? Can't he just sell the team to a local ownership group? I get the desire to do what makes him the most money...but he is already a billionaire. Just seems like a money grab. Just sell the (Franking) team so it can stay. Don't piss off an entire city/state/bi-state area so you can make a little more money. It would seem like the cool thing to do. I understand sports is a business, but it isn't to the fans...and that needs to account for something. The fans get hosed on these stupid deals. The fans are emotionally involved and pour their heart and souls (not to mention their hard earned money) into supporting this team. They deserve better than having teams pulled out from under them. It just doesn't seem right that an owner can up and move a team because of a money grab.

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 29, 2014 3:52 pm 
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Kroenke is not just a billionaire. He's a self made billionaire married to a billionaire that comes from the Walton (Wal Mart) family. The dude is oozing money. That's what makes this even more frustrating.

But Curt is right on all his points. Even if Kroenke wants to move the team, it doesn't necessarily mean he can. There are rules and blockades that discourage owners just picking up and moving. Plus, the NFL wants to own the stadium in LA. Kroenke can't be happy with that (he's a real estate guy and all).

Not to mention...LA STILL DOESN'T HAVE A STADIUM PLAN IN PLACE. They've got ideas out there, but none of them are close to happening whatsoever.

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