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PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2015 7:37 am 
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glen a richter wrote:
I would imagine that if the Rams leave, St. Louis would get another team eventually... the Jaguars possibly. I can't see that market being without a football team, #1, and #2 football, by virtue of simply how popular it is, is the only sport I could actually envision having a successful expansion to maybe 40 teams. Why keep a decent sized market out? Football is so popular, you could plop a team in East Nowhereland and probably sell out the stadium 8 times a year. It works in Green Bay.


But isn't this what they've been saying about LA for 20 years? Isn't this what they've said about Seattle when it comes to the NBA? From what the stadium task force has said, if the Rams leave, this stadium doesn't get built, because it's dependent on 250m directly from the owner. If you've got no owner to supply the money, then you've got a big hole in your financing.

I could be wrong though...Shad Khan was from this area and originally wanted to buy the Rams and pledged to keep them here. So maybe if the opportunity arose, he'd look to heading our way.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2015 2:35 pm 
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dmiles2186 wrote:
glen a richter wrote:
I would imagine that if the Rams leave, St. Louis would get another team eventually... the Jaguars possibly. I can't see that market being without a football team, #1, and #2 football, by virtue of simply how popular it is, is the only sport I could actually envision having a successful expansion to maybe 40 teams. Why keep a decent sized market out? Football is so popular, you could plop a team in East Nowhereland and probably sell out the stadium 8 times a year. It works in Green Bay.


But isn't this what they've been saying about LA for 20 years? Isn't this what they've said about Seattle when it comes to the NBA? From what the stadium task force has said, if the Rams leave, this stadium doesn't get built, because it's dependent on 250m directly from the owner. If you've got no owner to supply the money, then you've got a big hole in your financing.

I could be wrong though...Shad Khan was from this area and originally wanted to buy the Rams and pledged to keep them here. So maybe if the opportunity arose, he'd look to heading our way.

Khan just signed a 5 year agreement for the Jaguars to play overseas once a year.
PLUS, he isn't likely to pick up and move the team like Kroenke wants to do. From what I am hearing, he just isn't that kind of owner and is very dedicated to Jacksonville.

I bet my wife yesterday that the Rams will stay.

Here's why...

- The Board of Alderman passed the financing bill yesterday to build the stadium.
- The NFL agreed to kick in an additional 100 million towards the stadium (on top of the $200 million they were already kicking in) if the city would waive the amusement tax, which they did. That's kind of important here.
- The Carson City project is gaining a lot of steam & is considered quite viable and attractive to the league. From what I hear, the league is quite smitten with the idea of having Disney as an owner.
- Duing the January vote, the owners could quite conceivably block any attempt by Kroenke to move based on the fact that St. Louis now has a stadium finance plan in place and the stadium is basically ready to be built if the Rams are indeed staying. Why is that important? Because the owners would have a hard time claiming that they need public financing for future stadiums if Kroenke walks away from $400 million in public money to build his own stadium with his own money. It sets a bad precedent as far as the owners are concerned.

Of course, Kroenke could sue or threaten to sue and that could sway votes and of course anything can happen yet. But they were saying that the city of St. Louis has put themselves in the best possible position to keep the Rams leading into the January vote by the owners. I think a lot of people will be shocked if the owners vote in January to allow the Rams to move.
I know a lot of people think the Rams as still as good as gone, and they still might move, but the Rams staying is a much more realistic idea than it was when the season started.
And, of course, there is the possibility of Kroenke rejecting the stadium proposal and agreeing to a year to year lease on the dome, and him trying to move the Rams all over again in a couple years. But the backlash from that with the current stadium financing in place and ready to go, would be monumentally horrific for the NFL and Kroenke. But I doubt Kroenke gives a shit about any of that.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2015 8:10 pm 
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No matter what, St. Louis will end up with a team, be it the Rams or someone else. I'm not looking at the NFL finances but I doubt there's a single team out there from the Patriots all the way down to the shitstorm that is the Cleveland Browns who's losing money. The league can support more teams, pretty much any city would be able to sell out the stadium regularly, I don't think anyone in St. Louis has anything long term to worry about. If the Rams leave, someone else will swoop right in within a couple of seasons.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2015 8:21 pm 
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cprice12 wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:
glen a richter wrote:
I would imagine that if the Rams leave, St. Louis would get another team eventually... the Jaguars possibly. I can't see that market being without a football team, #1, and #2 football, by virtue of simply how popular it is, is the only sport I could actually envision having a successful expansion to maybe 40 teams. Why keep a decent sized market out? Football is so popular, you could plop a team in East Nowhereland and probably sell out the stadium 8 times a year. It works in Green Bay.


But isn't this what they've been saying about LA for 20 years? Isn't this what they've said about Seattle when it comes to the NBA? From what the stadium task force has said, if the Rams leave, this stadium doesn't get built, because it's dependent on 250m directly from the owner. If you've got no owner to supply the money, then you've got a big hole in your financing.

I could be wrong though...Shad Khan was from this area and originally wanted to buy the Rams and pledged to keep them here. So maybe if the opportunity arose, he'd look to heading our way.

Khan just signed a 5 year agreement for the Jaguars to play overseas once a year.
PLUS, he isn't likely to pick up and move the team like Kroenke wants to do. From what I am hearing, he just isn't that kind of owner and is very dedicated to Jacksonville.

I bet my wife yesterday that the Rams will stay.

Here's why...

- The Board of Alderman passed the financing bill yesterday to build the stadium.
- The NFL agreed to kick in an additional 100 million towards the stadium (on top of the $200 million they were already kicking in) if the city would waive the amusement tax, which they did. That's kind of important here.
- The Carson City project is gaining a lot of steam & is considered quite viable and attractive to the league. From what I hear, the league is quite smitten with the idea of having Disney as an owner.
- Duing the January vote, the owners could quite conceivably block any attempt by Kroenke to move based on the fact that St. Louis now has a stadium finance plan in place and the stadium is basically ready to be built if the Rams are indeed staying. Why is that important? Because the owners would have a hard time claiming that they need public financing for future stadiums if Kroenke walks away from $400 million in public money to build his own stadium with his own money. It sets a bad precedent as far as the owners are concerned.

Of course, Kroenke could sue or threaten to sue and that could sway votes and of course anything can happen yet. But they were saying that the city of St. Louis has put themselves in the best possible position to keep the Rams leading into the January vote by the owners. I think a lot of people will be shocked if the owners vote in January to allow the Rams to move.
I know a lot of people think the Rams as still as good as gone, and they still might move, but the Rams staying is a much more realistic idea than it was when the season started.
And, of course, there is the possibility of Kroenke rejecting the stadium proposal and agreeing to a year to year lease on the dome, and him trying to move the Rams all over again in a couple years. But the backlash from that with the current stadium financing in place and ready to go, would be monumentally horrific for the NFL and Kroenke. But I doubt Kroenke gives a shit about any of that.


Kroenke doesn't but the rest of the NFL owners surely do. The PR hit they will take from ripping a city willing to fund a 2nd stadium in 25 years will be immense. Bob McNair recently had some quotes fully in support of St. Louis (he was the one that came up with the 100 mil idea). He sits on both the LA committee and the finance committee. Jerry Richardson of the Panthers, as it was mentioned earlier in the thread, also is in support of STL and was the one who got Bob Iger involved with the Chargers/Raiders. He also sits on the LA committee.

To me, this is all pointing in STL's favor. I'm still holding my breath until that final owner vote takes place, but I'm beginning to really think the Rams staying is a possibility.

I'm going to the game tomorrow night just in case, but I think there is going to be a much more positive attitude than I would have thought at the beginning of the year.

As for Kroenke, he can put his mouth around the collective ballsack of St. Louis and gargle. A native son, a man who brought the team here, a man who is worth billions and billions on his own and wants to move the team to get more money? (Frank) right off you piece of garbage.

I really hope the rest of the owners force him to sell but I'm sure they can't do that. I forgot about Khan signing the lease and all of that with Jacksonville. My hope is that Kroenke buys the Broncos, Khad buys the Rams, and then I could care less who buys the Jags. I want Khan owning this team. That or someone who loves STL and will do every single thing to improve this team and this city.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 06, 2016 12:40 pm 
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Stan Kroenke is human garbage and should be ashamed of himself.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2016 9:21 am 
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dmiles2186 wrote:
Stan Kroenke is human garbage and should be ashamed of himself.


Yes he is and yes he should be. Unfortunately, because he is, he won't be.

I heard a rumor somewhere last week. No idea of the validity of it or if it's even something feasible. But, I heard the Broncos owner was considering selling the team and people talking about Kroenke being a good fit there since he owns so many Denver teams. I'm not sure if that's even allowed, but what better resolution to this than Kroenke leaving and the team staying?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2016 9:35 am 
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cardsfan04 wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:
Stan Kroenke is human garbage and should be ashamed of himself.


Yes he is and yes he should be. Unfortunately, because he is, he won't be.

I heard a rumor somewhere last week. No idea of the validity of it or if it's even something feasible. But, I heard the Broncos owner was considering selling the team and people talking about Kroenke being a good fit there since he owns so many Denver teams. I'm not sure if that's even allowed, but what better resolution to this than Kroenke leaving and the team staying?


That's been out there for a bit. The Broncos owner is suffering from Alzheimer's I believe, so the organization is in his kids' hands. Apparently, he wants it to stay in the family, but much like the two Rosenbloom kids after Georgia's death, it sounds like they may not want to run the team after he's gone. I think it's entirely possible that Kroenke could work out a deal where he sells the Rams and buys the Broncos, but I'm not sure the timetable for when that could happen.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2016 7:12 pm 
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dmiles2186 wrote:
cardsfan04 wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:
Stan Kroenke is human garbage and should be ashamed of himself.


Yes he is and yes he should be. Unfortunately, because he is, he won't be.

I heard a rumor somewhere last week. No idea of the validity of it or if it's even something feasible. But, I heard the Broncos owner was considering selling the team and people talking about Kroenke being a good fit there since he owns so many Denver teams. I'm not sure if that's even allowed, but what better resolution to this than Kroenke leaving and the team staying?


That's been out there for a bit. The Broncos owner is suffering from Alzheimer's I believe, so the organization is in his kids' hands. Apparently, he wants it to stay in the family, but much like the two Rosenbloom kids after Georgia's death, it sounds like they may not want to run the team after he's gone. I think it's entirely possible that Kroenke could work out a deal where he sells the Rams and buys the Broncos, but I'm not sure the timetable for when that could happen.


If that's the case, it makes even more sense why Kroenke is pushing to move the team to LA. Whatever costs he has to incur, he will be able to sell LA Rams at a hefty premium while the St. Louis Rams will certainly command a healthy discount.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2016 2:51 pm 
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Goodell sent a report to all 32 owners saying that none of the stadium proposals (SD, Oakland or STL) were satisfactory. They're voting soon (tomorrow?) on whether Rams can move. Doesn't look good. Yesterday afternoon I thought they were going to stay. I think Goodell put the nail in the coffin for them though.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2016 3:14 pm 
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cardsfan04 wrote:
Goodell sent a report to all 32 owners saying that none of the stadium proposals (SD, Oakland or STL) were satisfactory. They're voting soon (tomorrow?) on whether Rams can move. Doesn't look good. Yesterday afternoon I thought they were going to stay. I think Goodell put the nail in the coffin for them though.


The meetings/vote is Tuesday/Wednesday. When I initially saw the headline, I thought the same (nail in the coffin). But I think at this point, all this does it basically not block any team from the 3 horse race to LA...it doesn't eliminate any of them. But this also means that even if the Rams are left out of LA, they might still be approved in the future if Kroenke wants to go to SD, Toronto, San Antonio...wherever.

My final prediction (if I haven't posted it here, I'm too lazy to go back and look): SD/OAK go into the meetings as the leading project (which is where it's at right now). Neither project will have the 24 votes for approval so owners will continue to talk/iron things out and broker a deal between the Chargers/Rams to pair up in LA. Mark Davis and the Raiders will get a good chunk of the relocation money to pacify them for sticking in Oakland. SD and STL are left out in the cold. I become a Colts fan.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2016 3:29 pm 
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I like your interpretation better. Hopefully they don't let them leave, but I'm not very optimistic. I hadn't thought about it, but somebody suggested to me today that Kroenke could be giving some money under the table to make this happen. I hope that's not the case, but I'm so cynical toward Kroenke and the NFL that it wouldn't shock me if it is.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2016 1:26 pm 
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A lot of stuff going on today. LA Committee recommends Carson project, but Rams/Chargers marriage being pushed. However, Spanos and Davis remain committed as Spanos doesn't trust Enos.

Vote could happen today. If nothing else, we should know my tomorrow, either way. There was a report floated around that the Chargers would delay a year to avoid a marriage w/ the Rams...which...guh. I can't take another year of this.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2016 6:36 pm 
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"A proposal that would move the St. Louis Rams and a team to be determined to a yet-to-be-built stadium in Inglewood, California, leads 20-12 after the first round of owners' voting, according to a Los Angeles Times report."

Via ESPN about an hour ago.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2016 8:27 pm 
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Rams are gone. (Frank) Stan Kroenke.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2016 5:53 am 
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So long St. Louis Rams, hello St. Louis Jaguars.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2016 7:34 am 
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glen a richter wrote:
So long St. Louis Rams, hello St. Louis Jaguars.


Not holding out hope. Will be happy if it happens, but...everyone thought LA would get a team back quickly. Same for Seattle in basketball.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 10:43 am 
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I don't really buy the Jaguars rumors, not yet anyway. It feels to me like one of those things that gains traction because people think it kinda makes sense more than a rumor started from a legit source.

That said, I'll add a tiny bit of fuel to the fire. A family friend has a friend that's an attorney that has worked with Kroenke's lawyers. He said prior to this becoming official that there was a deal in the works for the Jaguars to move here. I'm taking it with a huge grain of salt for a whole variety of reasons (not the least of which is the "telephone game" nature of it).

Honestly, I'm not ready to decide if that's what I want. Still processing the Rams move, so not sure what I want to happen yet.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 3:47 pm 
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In an interview w/ the LA Times (funny how he goes 4 years without talking to STL media but day after LA move he's Chatty Catchy), he said that he didn't want to hang around STL and be a 'victim.' He literally used the word victim as someone being thrown 400 million of public money. This guy is a sketch comedy villain.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2016 4:52 pm 
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Yeah, I saw that. It's the kind of thing you can't make up.

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PostPosted: Wed May 04, 2016 5:54 pm 
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glen a richter wrote:
So long St. Louis Rams, hello St. Louis Jaguars.


I know this is an old thread, but I live in Jacksonville. The Jaguars aren't going anywhere. Khan is pouring tons of money into the area to develop including building things around the stadium to improve things. National media always seems to throw out Jacksonville as a team that will move. Problem - that was the owner before Khan and no one in the national media has a clue what's happening in the Jacksonville community. They just assume no one wants them here, including the owner, which is so far from the truth, it's laughable. Anyone bringing up fan attendance - the Dolphins and Bucs have had far worse fan attendance the past few years. Why aren't they moving to St Louis in the rumors? Solid ownership - which is exactly what the Jags have since Khan bought them.

On top of that, the Jags stadium is one helluva lot nicer than the Dome. Can St Louis maintain an outdoor swimming pool with cabanas at the game - as in inside the stadium, next to the field, while the game is being played?

If the Jags ever move anywhere it is to London and that's a super long shot.

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