It is currently Fri Nov 17, 2017 4:47 pm

Board index » Other Forums » Everything Else [OT]

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 272 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:13 am 
Offline
Site Admin
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 1:26 am
Posts: 21393
Location: Center Ice
Well, Hillary isn't as far ahead as the media keeps implying...
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/brian-han ... 59188.html

Still an uphill battle for Sanders where superdelegates will need to switch sides, but that very thing happened in 2008, so...we'll see. But Sanders needs to keep winning primaries for that to have a chance at happening. And one would think the New York debate conversation (Bernie is being too mean...which isn't true at all) is only hurting Hillary.

Interesting stuff for sure.

Quote:
The Media Vs. Bernie Sanders

Today, The Wall Street Journal ran a piece entitled, Bernie Sanders Gets No Respect, which is ironic in itself because the WSJ has generally written off Senator Sanders, just as The New York Times, CNN and MSNBC have written off Senator Sanders.

When the New York Times recently published a positive article about Sanders, it later went to great lengths to edit that piece and make it much less pro-Sanders.

Sanders supporters have grown sick of the media’s Clinton bias and most recently, their tendency to include super delegates in their delegate math, which gives Clinton a massive and misleading advantage because super delegates can still switch sides.

CNN, MSNBC and even Google almost always factor the totally-unofficial-super-delegates into their delegate counts, making Clinton look lightyears ahead of Sanders.

Image

If you notice, in the image above, it’s the light blue (super delegates) and not the dark blue (pledged delegates) that position Clinton as the clear Democratic frontrunner.

The problem is, in their highly scientific “delegate math,” CNN, MSNBC and Google are including the super delegates who haven’t even voted yet. This is a dirty and clever little trick designed to conceal the viability of a Sanders’ nomination.

Including super delegates at this point is not only misleading, but downright dishonest because the super delegates won’t vote until the Democratic National Convention. As they did for Obama in 2008, super delegates can and will transfer their support to Sanders if the Senator continues to win in primaries and caucuses.

Last week, the WSJ reported that Trump needs to win 57% of the remaining delegates to clinch the GOP nomination, stating that he has “a feasible path to winning.”

After sweeping three Western caucuses and winning 6 of the last 7 delegate battles, now it’s Sanders who needs only 57% of the remaining delegates to surpass Clinton and make the case that super delegates should switch over to his camp.

Image

But of course you’ll never hear the WSJ describing Sanders’ opportunity as “a feasible path to winning,” despite the fact that both he and Trump need the same 57%.

It’s not just the media bias that drives Sanders supporters bonkers, it’s the lack of coverage their candidate receives, especially in the earlier months of his campaign.

In 2015, for example, ABC World News Tonight allocated a mere 20 seconds to covering the Sanders campaign, while spending over 80 minutes talking about Donald Trump. Similarly, CBS set aside just six minutes to covering Sanders and NBC Nightly News spent less than three.

When social media was buzzing about Sanders’ historic upset in Michigan, the mainstream media was quiet. At that time, I published the article: Sanders Massively Outperforms Expectations in Michigan Primary, CNN Ignores It to Cover Trump.

Image

Why would the mainstream media want to silence a popular presidential candidate who’s educating the American people about our corrupt campaign finance system and vast levels of wealth and income inequality?

Why would the corporate media have a bias towards Hillary Clinton? Why would Time Warner and Comcast, the parent companies behind CNN and MSNBC, be among Clinton’s top ten campaign donors? Could it have anything to do with money?

Could it all be so simple?

_________________
Image
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 11:15 am 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
A long time ago I read a fantastic book called "What's the Matter with Kansas?" which addressed the topic of why Kansas always votes red even though the economics of that state, by and large, dictate that they should vote blue. It basically pointed out the fact that people don't generally vote for their own financial best interest because they get persuaded by ultimately less important wedge issues such as gay marriage, abortion or gun ownership rights. The #1 thing anyone in this country should care about, as gas starts inching back up and the value of a paycheck starts inching back down, is their financial interests. Everything else will fall into place but if you're not financially secure, you can be rattled by fear in other areas.

Realistically, 99% of the country SHOULD vote for Bernie Sanders, but the media will force feed us a steady diet of Hillary, Hillary, Hillary! when she's no better than the Republicans when it comes to dismissing the ever-dwindling middle class. No matter which one, Trump or Clinton, wins in November, America loses big time.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 5:22 pm 
Offline
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame

Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:43 am
Posts: 3987
I imagine most super delegates will switch to Bernie if he wins a majority of normal delegates. But, it's amazing to me that in 2016 there is a conceivable way for both parties to disenfranchise their electorates.

GOP: Hoping for a brokered convention so they can choose somebody other than who wins by a huge plurality and (if that's the case) just shy of a true majority.

DNC: Technically super delegates could stay with Hillary.

I mean, I kinda get it, especially on the DNC side. It makes sense to have some sort of safeguard in place should something crazy happen (i.e. Hillary wins majority of delegates, but then gets indicted--won't happen, but hypothetically).

The GOP is a bit more worrisome though. "We don't like who you guys voted for, so we're just going to choose our own."

_________________
2010-2011 Official LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk
2016-2017 Official LGB Sponsor of Dmitri Jaskin
2017-2018 Official LGB Sponsor of Jake Allen


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 5:46 pm 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
The super-delegates exist because after George McGovern got rocked in the general in '72 they wanted to make sure grassroots movements got stopped dead in their tracks in favor of the establishment. It's the most undemocratic concept in the world. If the people choose X, then Y shouldn't get nominated because the establishment thinks X will lose. Poll after poll shows Bernie doing better against Trump than Hillary. Kasich, should he pry the nomination at the convention, is actually polling ahead of Hillary, and when November rolls around I bet the DNC will be scratching their heads wondering where it all went wrong because I think they're in for a rude awakening when they find out no republicans and very few independents actually like Hillary enough to vote for her. Hillary v Trump could be historic low turnouts at the polls.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2016 6:02 pm 
Offline
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame

Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:43 am
Posts: 3987
The problem with Trump is that outside of the people that have him number 1, he's last for pretty much everybody else. I'm slightly concerned about the voter turnout for Hillary in November (should she win the nomination), but I know people that say they hate Hillary, but are afraid of Trump, so they'd show up to vote against him. I dunno, I've been wrong at pretty much every turn of this election cycle, so I'm not even going to make a prediction on that. But, I'm optimistic that Trump won't win the general election.

_________________
2010-2011 Official LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk
2016-2017 Official LGB Sponsor of Dmitri Jaskin
2017-2018 Official LGB Sponsor of Jake Allen


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:17 pm 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
Things are getting very very interesting on both sides.

Trump had a rally yesterday a couple towns over from me, apparently about 15,000 showed up. He needs NY with > 50% so he can get all the states delegates just to hang. No matter what, that convention is looking like a sure thing to be brokered.

As far as Sanders, man he's surging! Wyoming is probably a lock and then I get my chance to vote on the 19th. I think he'll surprise in NY, based on my very unscientific poll (literally hundreds of Bernie bumper stickers and only about a half dozen Hillary bumper stickers). The momentum he got from that huge win in Wisconsin can go a long way if he plays it right. Then the week after he's got Pennsylvania and he's closing the gap there too, latest polling has him down only about 6 points but trending in the right direction. The whole thing will come down to the superdelegates and I'd expect a huge to-do at that convention too. Get your popcorn, folks.

I seriously have to question the logic of anyone who's supporting Trump. I mean, I get that a lot of people are very enthusiastic about the whole make America great thing, but if you look at state by state polling, you'll find that he's actually losing, or close to losing, steady red states like Utah, Kansas, Mississippi... it could be a historic disaster. Even if he moves more moderate for the general election like any sensible candidate would do, he'll risk alienating the people who love him for his unfiltered persona and he won't magically get back the demographics he alienated already. In a general election where the winning candidate absolutely has to convince independents and crossover voters, the only Republican who would have any chance against Hillary or Sanders is John Kasich, and this has played out in every head to head poll so far. They both crush Trump, they both basically cruise against Cruz and they both lose to Kasich in nearly every poll. The Republican voters are effectively destroying themselves in an election where they should theoretically be able to just stroll right back into the White House.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Apr 19, 2016 6:01 pm 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
Got my vote in at 6:15 AM... I just hope there's enough of a turn in the tide to make it matter.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2016 7:49 pm 
Offline
1st Line Sniper
1st Line Sniper
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am
Posts: 894
glen a richter wrote:
No matter which one, Trump or Clinton, wins in November, America loses big time.


I'm still thinking there might be someone else parachuted in at one of the conventions to run so there could be some different names in play here - and I believe that would actually be a good thing. This country hasn't had a brokered convention in 40 years so should be interesting this summer.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 5:59 am 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
When the delegates are released and Trump is knocked off the ticket, he'll run third party.

When Hillary is indicted just prior to the convention and they decide to nominate Joe Biden, Sanders will run third party.

Maybe a 4-way race is what this country needs--we'll see who people REALLY want when it's not a glorified "lesser of two evils" election.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 7:42 am 
Offline
1st Line Sniper
1st Line Sniper
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am
Posts: 894
glen a richter wrote:
When the delegates are released and Trump is knocked off the ticket, he'll run third party.

When Hillary is indicted just prior to the convention and they decide to nominate Joe Biden, Sanders will run third party.

Maybe a 4-way race is what this country needs--we'll see who people REALLY want when it's not a glorified "lesser of two evils" election.


Yeah I can see that - especially with Trump - he will claim he was unfairly treated and run independent just to spite the Republican party. And the Dems want Bernie out now cause the longer he stays in and argues with Hillary the tougher it is for her. This year by far will be the strangest election we've ever had.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 8:19 am 
Offline
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame

Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:43 am
Posts: 3987
glen a richter wrote:
When the delegates are released and Trump is knocked off the ticket, he'll run third party.

When Hillary is indicted just prior to the convention and they decide to nominate Joe Biden, Sanders will run third party.

Maybe a 4-way race is what this country needs--we'll see who people REALLY want when it's not a glorified "lesser of two evils" election.


I think the Dem side will wrap up cleanly with a Hillary win, possibly next week. If that happens, I don't anticipate an indictment or Bernie running independently.

The GOP is another matter though. I suspect Trump will be on the ballot regardless of whether he wins the nomination. Would definitely seem like his style to run third party out of spite. That could potentially open the door for Kasich to get the nomination (I kinda doubt it would be Cruz). I think Kasich would make a good president, and would be really tempted to vote for him if that happens. Something really bothers me about the GOP ignoring their electorate though. I get they don't want Trump because he's a buffoon and might make Dukakis look successful. But, I really dislike the undemocratic nature of what they're trying to do. Same goes for the Dems and the Superdelegates, but I think Hillary will win the normal delegates anyway, so it's a moot point.

_________________
2010-2011 Official LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk
2016-2017 Official LGB Sponsor of Dmitri Jaskin
2017-2018 Official LGB Sponsor of Jake Allen


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 8:41 am 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
I don't agree with Kasich's educational plan or attitude towards teachers, but then again politicians on both sides are vehemently anti-teacher anyway so I lose one way or another. What it boils down to me now is the Supreme Court. In a 3-way race I may vote for Kasich to send a message that I don't approve of Hillary one bit. In a 2-way race Trump may be viable in NY so then I'm up a creek on what to do.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 6:43 am 
Offline
1st Line Sniper
1st Line Sniper
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am
Posts: 894
Bernie supporters are VERY supportive of him though and hate Hillary. It will be a challenge for her to win them over. I believe Bernie will throw his support to her.

Trump will run independently out of spite. The thing is - he's not a conservative and that's a big problem and makes me wonder how he's allowed to run as a GOP candidate. Kasich is a good man and I like that he's the 'adult' in the room and doesnt have any scandal hanging over him. But I believe Cruz will offer the VP slot to Kasich or Rubio to get the nomination


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 8:56 am 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
Not that it's particularly shocking how it turned out, but you can stick a fork in Sanders, he's done. Now to buy my "Don't blame me I voted for Bernie" bumper sticker.

It just boggles the mind how much exponentially crappier each election gets. I might just write myself in. I'm eligible.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Apr 27, 2016 11:29 am 
Offline
1st Line Sniper
1st Line Sniper
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am
Posts: 894
All 4 candidates are bad but Bernie by far was the scariest - since when was this country based on socialism? People love free stuff and it's very hard to compete against a guy that promotes that. That's how Obama won 2 elections. This country was founded on capitalism and should remain so.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 8:50 am 
Offline
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame

Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:43 am
Posts: 3987
Kerfuffle wrote:
All 4 candidates are bad but Bernie by far was the scariest


I'm still counting Kasich among the candidates. If it goes to a brokered convention, I think there's a pretty decent chance he'll get the nomination, especially if it gets to a 3rd ballot. I can't see it going to Cruz, and if Trump doesn't get 1237 or very close to it, I think he'll struggle to add delegates.

I don't like everything Bernie says. Some of his policies are a bit overboard, but he's nowhere near as scary as Trump and Cruz. I think a lot of people miss the mark in criticizing him though.

Kerfuffle wrote:
- since when was this country based on socialism? People love free stuff and it's very hard to compete against a guy that promotes that. That's how Obama won 2 elections. This country was founded on capitalism and should remain so.


Bernie isn't a socialist. He's a DEMOCRATIC socialist. There's a really big difference in that democratic socialism calls for private ownership which is necessary for economic growth whereas pure socialism significantly limits that. Democratic socialism is about a level playing field in a capitalist market. As it stands, huge corporations get to use their money to influence the dynamics of the market in their favor. That's what Bernie is against, not capitalism.

Socialism and capitalism aren't even opposites. Communism would be a better example of that. In fact, we have plenty of socialist practices in society already. Roads, police, firefighters, military, public schools, etc. are all socialist in nature.

A purely socialist society would be a bad thing for economic growth. Some of his ideas like free higher education and $15 minimum wage aren't great. What I like about him is that A) I don't think he could implement his ideas as stated which lowers how "scary" he actually is and B) he seems to have a legitimate interest in helping the middle class instead of the hollow words you hear from other politicians that are funded by big business. You don't want to disincentivize progress, but that doesn't mean big businesses should get by without checks though either.

_________________
2010-2011 Official LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk
2016-2017 Official LGB Sponsor of Dmitri Jaskin
2017-2018 Official LGB Sponsor of Jake Allen


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 11:41 am 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
The right has done a swell job of making "socialist" a dirty word. What gets me is the constant misuse of the words communism, socialism and democratic socialism. Three totally different things that the gop use interchangeably.

As far as America not being socialist and misuse of the terms, a colleague of mine who originally hails from China says China is less socialist than America. We have a hybrid system, whether anyone wants to agree or not. If you prefer pure capitalism then please don't use the post office , police, fire department, 911 or the roads. Also, I'll be more than happy to take your social security checks when you start qualifying for them.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 4:41 pm 
Offline
1st Line Sniper
1st Line Sniper
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am
Posts: 894
glen a richter wrote:
Also, I'll be more than happy to take your social security checks when you start qualifying for them.


See that's the whole problem glen - social security is not a socialism program - I pay into it and deserve my checks on the back end. What Bernie wants is to have everyone pay into it but only those who need it get to draw from it and that's socialism. People love free stuff and thats what has rallied so many to Bernie's cause. Free college? Sounds great to the young adults and gets you lots of voters but who pays for it? Result - higher taxes. $15 minimum wage? Sounds great to the unskilled and uneducated but again who pays for it? All of us in the form of higher prices. Working fast food was never meant to be a career - so if someone is 35 and packaging fries at McDonald's that's their fault - I feel no responsibility nor sympathy that I need to pay more to fund these folks poor life choices.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 5:10 pm 
Offline
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame

Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:43 am
Posts: 3987
Kerfuffle wrote:
glen a richter wrote:
Also, I'll be more than happy to take your social security checks when you start qualifying for them.


See that's the whole problem glen - social security is not a socialism program - I pay into it and deserve my checks on the back end. What Bernie wants is to have everyone pay into it but only those who need it get to draw from it and that's socialism. People love free stuff and thats what has rallied so many to Bernie's cause. Free college? Sounds great to the young adults and gets you lots of voters but who pays for it? Result - higher taxes. $15 minimum wage? Sounds great to the unskilled and uneducated but again who pays for it? All of us in the form of higher prices. Working fast food was never meant to be a career - so if someone is 35 and packaging fries at McDonald's that's their fault - I feel no responsibility nor sympathy that I need to pay more to fund these folks poor life choices.


I don't have a problem with social security or expanding it, but I understand why others do. I don't mind it because I think a society as prosperous and advanced as ours has a responsibility to take care of those in need, and I don't think that it's accurate to blindly blame poor life choices for somebody's poor plight. Sometimes that's true, sometimes it's not.

I'm mostly with you on the other 2 examples though, but for different reasons. $15 minimum wage would cause inflation, but mild inflation isn't a bad thing especially if it's countered by more people having money to put into the economy. My main aversion to it is that while McDonald's could handle it, small businesses probably couldn't. I have seen studies that show raising minimum wage doesn't actually cause the negative effects that people say it will, but I'd like to see longer term studies before fully buying into that.

Free education is something that sounds very nice, especially to somebody with a ton of debt from (soon to be) 2 degrees. Like healthcare, the longterm solution needs to be finding a way to keep costs down, not for the government to pick them up and distribute them to everybody via taxes. I have stronger feelings about healthcare because it is more of a need than education, but the problem is that a free market for necessities allows for borderline predatory practices that essentially just shifts wealth from the middle class to the upper class. Making things free doesn't solve that problem. Neither does ignoring it though either, which is why I like Bernie. He's at least making these things part of a legitimate discussion.

_________________
2010-2011 Official LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk
2016-2017 Official LGB Sponsor of Dmitri Jaskin
2017-2018 Official LGB Sponsor of Jake Allen


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 7:21 pm 
Offline
Hockey God
Hockey God

Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Posts: 9604
Location: Long Island, NY
Happy mediums include affordable public education (fixed low tuition) and making social security state-by-state and optional. That is say anyone born after 2018 will not be able to collect federally adminstered social security but can opt into a state run system or opt to go on their own, kind of like opting into a pension system vs a 401k on your own. Bernie's extremism is a starter to getting some really good things done for the working class. It's like if you're Brian Elliott. You don't start contract negotiations at a mil a year, you aim insanely high then dial it back. Bernie is the same. He's a smart man, he knows he's shooting too high, but you have to start high to get anywhere. You have to take chances.

_________________
LGB sponsor of Vince Dunn 2017-2018


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 272 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14  Next

Board index » Other Forums » Everything Else [OT]

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 7 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group