Offseason Changes to the Roster?

[Oaklandblue]

Blues property under contract for next year 18 players $47 M cap hit
David Backes
T.J. Oshie
Alex Steen
Magnus Paajarvi
Maxim Lapierre
Vlad Tarasenko
Dmitrij Jaskin
Chris Porter
Ryan Reaves
Ty Rattie

Jay Bouwmeester
Alex Pietrangelo
Kevin Shattenkirk
Barret Jackman
Roman Polak
Jordan Leopold
Ian Cole

Jake Allen

RFAs 3 players anticipated cap hit $8 - 9 M
Schwartz
Sobotka
Berglund

Wow, we look pretty damn good. Get Jaden and Boat a healthy raise and deal Bergy.

[drwoland]

Blues property under contract for next year 18 players $47 M cap hit
David Backes
T.J. Oshie
Alex Steen
Magnus Paajarvi
Maxim Lapierre
Vlad Tarasenko
Dmitrij Jaskin
Chris Porter
Ryan Reaves
Ty Rattie

Jay Bouwmeester
Alex Pietrangelo
Kevin Shattenkirk
Barret Jackman
Roman Polak
Jordan Leopold
Ian Cole

Jake Allen

RFAs 3 players anticipated cap hit $8 - 9 M
Schwartz
Sobotka
Berglund

Wow, we look pretty damn good. Get Jaden and Boat a healthy raise and deal Bergy.

But don't forget to fire Armstrong in the process

[Nyghtewynd]

Some of you need to look up Stockholm Syndrome. Good to see I'm supposed to be excited about the same lineup that's failed for three straight years, only with no goalie and the same lack of scoring ability. Sign me up.

[flyingnote38]

"I come not to praise caesar...."

just to set the baseline for the offseason roster changes. This is what we have and have committed in terms of $$$.

I would say we need to add two top 6 forwards -- preferably a center for line #2 and a winger with 30+ goal potential -- and a goalie without sacrificing Tarasenko, Schwartz, Backes, Steen, or Oshie

To do that and keep payroll feasible, we likely need to deal a d man and Berglund

I personally don't have a huge issue with Berglund (take a look at his 2011-2 and 2012-3 seasons before you decide not to qualify him). His biggest problem is he should be a poor man's Toews but instead looks like a rich man's Sobotka, and we already have a Sobotka and he's much better on face-offs. Left to choose between the two of them as 3rd line center, I think Sobotka benefits us more in the lineup but that Berglund would likely have more value in trade. But we aren't going to be able to trade Berglund straight up for an elite winger cause Dale Tallon doesn't have any and Berglund has never played for the Hawks.

As for D, I doubt Polak, Jackman, or Leopold has much trade value, so that leaves you with one of your top 3 which quickly narrows to Shattenkirk. Not saying they'll do it, or even will consider it, and certainly not unless the return justifies it, but you gotta break eggs to make mayonaise as they say. We should be able to sign a second pair dman for alot less than it would take to sign an elite scoring winger.

If all we do this offseason is promote Jaskin, Rattie and Allen, we are kissing our "window" good-bye. Add in missing 3 first round picks in this 5 year stretch ending in 2015, would be resetting the rebuild back a long way.

Now if we could get the same package return for say Oshie and Leopold as we could for Berglund and Shattenkirk, then I might do that instead.

And one last thing, Steve Ott sucks. still.

[Oaklandblue]

Some of you need to look up Stockholm Syndrome. Good to see I'm supposed to be excited about the same lineup that's failed for three straight years, only with no goalie and the same lack of scoring ability. Sign me up.

It's a good base. We need to sign scorers and centers, but we have something good to work with. Army has to throw his balls out there and actually get us the elites we need. I don't want to hear the money bs, this gives us more than enough room to sign what we need to win. If Army doesn't, I don't know what to tell you. I know there was an interview with Army, but I am more interested in Stillman's reaction to everything because that's what is going to be the course of action.

I wouldn't give up Shatts, although for the right players, I'd consider it. Same with Pie. There's a point we have to consider to go big or go home. Not saying we should trade off Pie or Shatts, but if it gives us the best chance of upgrading the team enough to be a real threat, we should consider it unless it's just insane. This mediocrity can not continue. Making the playoffs and burning out is simply not enough.

[flyingnote38]

Blues property under contract for next year 18 players $47 M cap hit
David Backes
T.J. Oshie
Alex Steen
Magnus Paajarvi
Maxim Lapierre
Vlad Tarasenko
Dmitrij Jaskin
Chris Porter
Ryan Reaves
Ty Rattie

Jay Bouwmeester
Alex Pietrangelo
Kevin Shattenkirk
Barret Jackman
Roman Polak
Jordan Leopold
Ian Cole

Jake Allen

RFAs 3 players anticipated cap hit $8 - 9 M
Schwartz
Sobotka
Berglund

Wow, we look pretty damn good. Get Jaden and Boat a healthy raise and deal Bergy.

But don't forget to fire Armstrong in the process

hmmm Backes, Oshie, Steen, Jackman, Polak, Reaves, Berglund, and Cole were all Blues property before Armstrong was hired as VP of player personell. Sobotka was acquired prior to his being named GM. Pietrangelo and Allen were drafted in 2008 7 days after he was hired so again I doubt he was running that year's draft.

Outside of Schwartz and Tarasenko, there's not anyone from the 2009 or 2010 drafts that Armstrong did run on that list or in the NHL elsewhere. The first Dave Taylor class in 2011 produced Rattie and Jaskin, and Edmundson and Binnington look like stronger shots to make it than the rest of Armstrong's picks.

so in 4 years as GM, Armstrong has added Bouwmeester, Shattenkirk, Paajarvi, Lapierre and Leopold.

He's subtracted Halak, Brewer, Johnson, McClement, Boyes, Perron, D'Agostini, Winchester, Nikitin and Bishop.

Why is firing him so crazy an idea?

[Oaklandblue]

Blues property under contract for next year 18 players $47 M cap hit
David Backes
T.J. Oshie
Alex Steen
Magnus Paajarvi
Maxim Lapierre
Vlad Tarasenko
Dmitrij Jaskin
Chris Porter
Ryan Reaves
Ty Rattie

Jay Bouwmeester
Alex Pietrangelo
Kevin Shattenkirk
Barret Jackman
Roman Polak
Jordan Leopold
Ian Cole

Jake Allen

RFAs 3 players anticipated cap hit $8 - 9 M
Schwartz
Sobotka
Berglund

Wow, we look pretty damn good. Get Jaden and Boat a healthy raise and deal Bergy.

But don't forget to fire Armstrong in the process

hmmm Backes, Oshie, Steen, Jackman, Polak, Reaves, Berglund, and Cole were all Blues property before Armstrong was hired as VP of player personell. Sobotka was acquired prior to his being named GM. Pietrangelo and Allen were drafted in 2008 7 days after he was hired so again I doubt he was running that year's draft.

Outside of Schwartz and Tarasenko, there's not anyone from the 2009 or 2010 drafts that Armstrong did run on that list or in the NHL elsewhere. The first Dave Taylor class in 2011 produced Rattie and Jaskin, and Edmundson and Binnington look like stronger shots to make it than the rest of Armstrong's picks.

so in 4 years as GM, Armstrong has added Bouwmeester, Shattenkirk, Paajarvi, Lapierre and Leopold.

He's subtracted Halak, Brewer, Johnson, McClement, Boyes, Perron, D'Agostini, Winchester, Nikitin and Bishop.

Why is firing him so crazy an idea?

The main reason would be who would we replace Army with who wouldn't be worse. Sure we have Hull and Mac and such but just saying as an example, Gretzky seems like a decent businessman but there's no way I'd let him be a GM, beyond driving a GM. What data do we have about Hull and Mac or whoeverelsehaveyou? We could be alot worse than we are with Army. Army hasn't traded the farm...yet.

[flyingnote38]

Why is firing him so crazy an idea?

The main reason would be who would we replace Army with who wouldn't be worse. Sure we have Hull and Mac and such but just saying as an example, Gretzky seems like a decent businessman but there's no way I'd let him be a GM, beyond driving a GM. What data do we have about Hull and Mac or whoeverelsehaveyou? We could be alot worse than we are with Army. Army hasn't traded the farm...yet.

If you don't trust Hull or Chopper's hockey instincts

How about this guy
General Manager: Jarmo Kekalainen

or this guy
SCOTTY BOWMAN
SENIOR ADVISOR, HOCKEY OPERATIONS

Scotty Bowman is in his sixth season with the Chicago Blackhawks as Senior Advisor to Hockey Operations. A part of 13 Stanley Cup-winning teams, including the 2010 and 2013 championships with the Blackhawks, Bowman brings 57 years of hockey experience to the organization.

[Oaklandblue]

Why is firing him so crazy an idea?

The main reason would be who would we replace Army with who wouldn't be worse. Sure we have Hull and Mac and such but just saying as an example, Gretzky seems like a decent businessman but there's no way I'd let him be a GM, beyond driving a GM. What data do we have about Hull and Mac or whoeverelsehaveyou? We could be alot worse than we are with Army. Army hasn't traded the farm...yet.

If you don't trust Hull or Chopper's hockey instincts

How about this guy
General Manager: Jarmo Kekalainen

or this guy
SCOTTY BOWMAN
SENIOR ADVISOR, HOCKEY OPERATIONS

Scotty Bowman is in his sixth season with the Chicago Blackhawks as Senior Advisor to Hockey Operations. A part of 13 Stanley Cup-winning teams, including the 2010 and 2013 championships with the Blackhawks, Bowman brings 57 years of hockey experience to the organization.

Simple question in regards to Mac and Hull and I think it's fair to ask. Brett's got some really good insight but that doesn't mean he could GM. Mac, I have no idea where he's at. I wasn't questioning their instincts, I was asking for examples of their choices and the end result, and for a GM for our team I think that's a valid question to ask.

After this year, Jarmo is furniture for the BJ's. Iirc he hasn't won a Cup yet for any of the teams he's GM'd and what he did for the BJs, which quite impressive, amounts to about where we're at right now. To me, he's the equivalent of trading Halak for Miller.

You really think Scotty is going to leave the Blackhawks organization when they've won two cups in four years and are contending for the Cup this year? You're crazy.

And okay, since we're talking crazy, I'll throw out a name for a GM I think would work for us, but I doubt he'd do it: Don Cherry.

Note I said we're talking crazy.

[flyingnote38]

Why is firing him so crazy an idea?

The main reason would be who would we replace Army with who wouldn't be worse. Sure we have Hull and Mac and such but just saying as an example, Gretzky seems like a decent businessman but there's no way I'd let him be a GM, beyond driving a GM. What data do we have about Hull and Mac or whoeverelsehaveyou? We could be alot worse than we are with Army. Army hasn't traded the farm...yet.

If you don't trust Hull or Chopper's hockey instincts

How about this guy
General Manager: Jarmo Kekalainen

or this guy
SCOTTY BOWMAN
SENIOR ADVISOR, HOCKEY OPERATIONS

Scotty Bowman is in his sixth season with the Chicago Blackhawks as Senior Advisor to Hockey Operations. A part of 13 Stanley Cup-winning teams, including the 2010 and 2013 championships with the Blackhawks, Bowman brings 57 years of hockey experience to the organization.

Simple question in regards to Mac and Hull and I think it's fair to ask. Brett's got some really good insight but that doesn't mean he could GM. Mac, I have no idea where he's at. I wasn't questioning their instincts, I was asking for examples of their choices and the end result, and for a GM for our team I think that's a valid question to ask.

After this year, Jarmo is furniture for the BJ's. Iirc he hasn't won a Cup yet for any of the teams he's GM'd and what he did for the BJs, which quite impressive, amounts to about where we're at right now. To me, he's the equivalent of trading Halak for Miller.

You really think Scotty is going to leave the Blackhawks organization when they've won two cups in four years and are contending for the Cup this year? You're crazy.

And okay, since we're talking crazy, I'll throw out a name for a GM I think would work for us, but I doubt he'd do it: Don Cherry.

Note I said we're talking crazy.

Ok so the Bowman thing was a joke. The Blues obviously won't fire Armstrong, but..

1) he really hasn't done much to build this roster. He inherited a team ready to compete and has taken it backwards rather than forward.
2) the "there's no way to replace him" argument is lame. There's nobody in the world who could do a better job? I'm not in the business so I couldn't tell you the best option, but there are no doubt assistant GMs around the league or others who are on people's short lists for their next GM

[cprice12]

Armstrong has brought in key members of the organization including 2012 Jack Adams winner Ken Hitchcock and 2012 Jennings Trophy winners Brian Elliott and Jaroslav Halak.

Armstrong has also orchestrated the additions of Chris Stewart, Kevin Shattenkirk and Jay Bouwmeester, as well as the drafts of Dmitrij Jaskin, Jaden Schwartz and Vladimir Tarasenko.

Armstrong and Yzerman are currently the only two General Managers in the NHL that are members of the “Triple Gold Club”, having been on the management staff for a Stanley Cup, Olympic gold medal and World Championship gold medal.

That profile is from the Blues official site, and it's only part of it...and it's a bit outdated as it doesn't include the Miller deal...which I still think was a slam dunk positive for us.

He is one of the best GM's in the NHL...if not THE best. I am pretty dumbfounded that some of you want him gone.

You guys don't see your comments as knee jerk reactions to the bitter loss to the Hawks?
This team certainly needs to address some issues...but getting rid of Armstrong & Hitchcock would be taking a few huge steps backwards, IMO. I don't get it.

Adding Shattenkirk & Bouwmeester...drafting Schwartz, trading up to nab Tarasenko in the draft... signing Elliott & Hitchcock... these have all been proven to be spectacular moves. And if we could have scored a few goals on the PP against Chicago, I think the Miller trade would have looked better than it has.

But whatever...let's get rid of Armstrong. Is Larry Pleau still available? Maybe we can bring back the ghost of Ron Caron? I'm sure Mike Keenan would like to be Coach & GM in the NHL again.

[dmiles2186]

puck daddy seems to think Miller was fairly bad in the playoffs

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck- ... 17694.html

That save percentage in the 4 games we lost is brutal.

I also don't get how people hold Miller blameless for game 3. I get that we got shut out but the goal against was soft. If that goal is unstoppable, then no blame for Miller. But that softie decided the game any way you slice it

Because it was one friggin' goal 5 minutes into the game. For 55 more minutes, he played shutout hockey (minus the empty netter, obviously). The offense had 55 minutes to come up with 1 or 2 goals and they didn't. That's why I don't pin it on him. It was a soft goal, but every goalie in the history of ever has given up a soft goal. The offense didn't show up at all.

[dmiles2186]

So there was a discussion of Berglund to Edmonton a few pages back. Here's an Edmontonian's thoughts on it: (Hint--he doesn't like it because Berglund is teh suck)

http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/2014/0 ... raro-says/

TSN’s Ray Ferraro, one of the most opinionated and cagey commentators in hockey, had an interesting though speculative trade proposal on Thursday, which was transcribed on Twitter by @Hope_Smoke: “Ferraro: ‘the Blues would be able to move some of their forwards, a more complete guy, for someone who scores. Someone like Berglund’…Ferraro suggesting Eberle going back the other way…Ferraro: ‘would you consider one of the Blues’ D like Shattenkirk and Berglund for Eberle and someone else?’…Ferraro: ‘What what Berglund look like down the middle playing behind Nugent-Hopkins.’…Ferraro: ‘If the Oilers don’t consider that they need to have their coconuts examined.’”
Would you build a trade around Eberle for Berglund?
YesNo
VoteView ResultsPolldaddy.com

rsz 1rsz game 77 eberle Oilers should look at a trade like Jordan Eberle for Patrick Berglund, TSNs Ray Ferraro says

What do you think of a trade built around moving a player like Eberle for a player like Berglund, who played four games in the Blues opening round loss to Chicago and didn’t pick up a single point?

My first thought is that Eberle was just identified by name by Oilers GM Craig MacTavish as one of the core group of Oilers players. The other three named were Justin Schultz, Taylor Hall and Ryan Nugent-Hopkins: “Those guys have to feel they’re the Edmonton Oilers and they have the responsibility to drive this core for many years.”

Berglund, 25, a low-first round pick in the 2006 draft, was a key forward on a very good St. Louis Blues team, playing behind David Backes and Alex Steen at centre. Berglund is large 6-feet, 3-inches, 220-pounds. He’s been in the NHL six years now and is a restricted free agent.

In his career, he’s played 436 regular season games and has 220 points, so that’s what you can expect out of him on the attack, about a point every second game. The Blues used him on their second power play unit.
My take?

I guess I need my coconuts examined, but I wouldn’t make this trade for a few reasons.

1. Eberle is the best player in this trade. The old NHL rule is that the team that gets the best player in a trade, wins that trade. So the Oilers would be losing.

2. The Oilers will never be a winning team if they can’t develop players like Berglund, a large, effective two-way centre, on their own. The Oilers need to turn Jujhar Khaira or Bogdan Yakimov into their Berglund, not pick up this kind of piece by trading a top attacker.

3. The Oilers should try to get Berglund, but Berglund should be the best player in the trade. Edmonton’s goal should be to give up a number of lesser pieces for Berglund, not to get a number of lesser pieces for Eberle.

4. Berglund is an RFA. He’ll command a good contract. Are the Blues willing to pay? If not, they might well be willing to move him for smaller pieces.

5. Eberle is the second top attacker on an Oilers team that didn’t exactly score goals at will.

6. Eberle is locked into a long-term contract, he’s played strong two-way hockey in the past, he’s not big but he most often makes good decisions with and without the puck. He’s going to be a 65-to-70 point forward for years to come.

He’s not part of the problem in Edmonton, he’s part of the solution, a big part, as MacTavish has said.

Why do you move such a player? And why would you move such a player unless he’s part of a package for a markedly superior player?

P.S. A few readers have pointed out I didn’t address the Oilers are also picking up a player like d-man Kevin Shattenkirk in this proposal. Shattenkirk, 25, had 45 points in 81 games for the Blues. He’s not a big defender, nor is he physical. In other words, he’s more of what the Oilers already have in Justin Schultz and Jeff Petry. In Ferraro’s proposal, it was also unclear what other piece the Oilers might have to give up to get Shattenkirk.

Shattenkirk will earn $4.2 million a year for the next three years.

Perhaps Shattenkirk is a top-pairing NHL d-man in the making, but I’ve never seen his game that way. That’s what the Oilers need, and any trade that doesn’t return a player like that isn’t going to wow most fans, I suspect.

[cprice12]

puck daddy seems to think Miller was fairly bad in the playoffs

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck- ... 17694.html

That save percentage in the 4 games we lost is brutal.

I also don't get how people hold Miller blameless for game 3. I get that we got shut out but the goal against was soft. If that goal is unstoppable, then no blame for Miller. But that softie decided the game any way you slice it

Because it was one friggin' goal 5 minutes into the game. For 55 more minutes, he played shutout hockey (minus the empty netter, obviously). The offense had 55 minutes to come up with 1 or 2 goals and they didn't. That's why I don't pin it on him. It was a soft goal, but every goalie in the history of ever has given up a soft goal. The offense didn't show up at all.

It was a shitty goal...but he more than made up for it with a number of great saves later in the game.
Miller did his part in that game...the rest of the team did not get it done. The blame on Miller in game #3 is minimal...and asking him to shut out the Hawks in Chicago in a game they had to win would have been a monumental task.

[A-Yo1965]

Hey everyone!

It has been a LONG time since I have been here but unfortunately the fortunes for the Blues haven't changed.

Now, I may be seen as nuts for what I am about to say and I know most here will either correct me, praise or call me crazy. I am thinking it will be more of the first and last so here goes.

Three moves:

One - Trade Miller (while we still have him) and Oshie and first rounder to Toronto for Kessel
Two - Ott/Shatt/Berg to the Islanders for Tavares
Three - release Jackman

The Blues need scoring, speed and skill. I think these moves help that while trying to keep an eye on being realistic.

Moving Miller/Oshie to Toronto helps both teams. Olympians involved so no one can b(%%# about one team making off better than the other and the games I saw with Toronto this year, OMGAWD!!! Goaltending was HORRIBLE!

Its good to be back and I hope everyone is doing well!

[dmiles2186]

Two - Ott/Shatt/Berg to the Islanders for Tavares

Welcome back!

Although, I gotta say, there's no way Ott/Shatt/Berg net Tavares. Gonna have to give up way more.

[A-Yo1965]

Two - Ott/Shatt/Berg to the Islanders for Tavares

Welcome back!

Although, I gotta say, there's no way Ott/Shatt/Berg net Tavares. Gonna have to give up way more.

Thanks!

It's good to be back. Okoposo instead of Tavares?

[Nyghtewynd]

Armstrong has brought in key members of the organization including 2012 Jack Adams winner Ken Hitchcock and 2012 Jennings Trophy winners Brian Elliott and Jaroslav Halak.

Armstrong has also orchestrated the additions of Chris Stewart, Kevin Shattenkirk and Jay Bouwmeester, as well as the drafts of Dmitrij Jaskin, Jaden Schwartz and Vladimir Tarasenko.

Armstrong and Yzerman are currently the only two General Managers in the NHL that are members of the “Triple Gold Club”, having been on the management staff for a Stanley Cup, Olympic gold medal and World Championship gold medal.

That profile is from the Blues official site, and it's only part of it...and it's a bit outdated as it doesn't include the Miller deal...which I still think was a slam dunk positive for us.

He is one of the best GM's in the NHL...if not THE best. I am pretty dumbfounded that some of you want him gone.

You'd think that one of the best GMs in the league could put together a team that could eventually win one playoff series.

And the Miller deal was one gigantic bust that may have mortgaged the future of the organization for two playoff game wins. Is that the definition of "slam dunk"?

[Misc. Blues]

Hey everyone!

It has been a LONG time since I have been here but unfortunately the fortunes for the Blues haven't changed.

Now, I may be seen as nuts for what I am about to say and I know most here will either correct me, praise or call me crazy. I am thinking it will be more of the first and last so here goes.

Three moves:

One - Trade Miller (while we still have him) and Oshie and first rounder to Toronto for Kessel
Two - Ott/Shatt/Berg to the Islanders for Tavares
Three - release Jackman

The Blues need scoring, speed and skill. I think these moves help that while trying to keep an eye on being realistic.

Moving Miller/Oshie to Toronto helps both teams. Olympians involved so no one can b(%%# about one team making off better than the other and the games I saw with Toronto this year, OMGAWD!!! Goaltending was HORRIBLE!

Its good to be back and I hope everyone is doing well!

Miller being traded gives Buffalo another conditional pick and Kessel is comming for Oshie and a #1 that we can't afford to lose? Ott is most likely returning to Buffalo so his value is zero Shatty and Bergie won't happen for Tavi. Jackman released yeah that's not going to happen. Mostlikely Jax retires a Blue. I know Jax is the whipping boy around here but Hawks fans hate him the most so we keep him just for that alone. He's not as bad as everyone thinks he's a solid actually.

On a side not I say we pick up Hiller(ufa) and maybe Moulson if he doesn't re-sign with the wild. I know people get on Bergie but what do expect a guy to do in the playoffs with a dislocated shoulder?

[not_a_wings_fan]

"I come to bury caesar, not to praise him."

Fixord

You from the Ken Hitchcock school where you can't get your line combinations right?