Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Discuss the St. Louis Blues, the NHL, or anything hockey.

Moderator: LGB Mods

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby glen a richter » Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:02 pm

Back in 2-3 games for sure or a motivational tactic for the boys over the next 2-3 games? After that hit I'd be shocked if he was back sometime in the next 2-3 months. But if Hitch says 2-3 days I'll go with it.
LGB sponsor of Ian Cole 2011-2012
LGB sponsor of Gary Bettman's Pink Slip 2013
LGB sponsor of Dmitrij Jaskin 2013-2014
LGB sponsor of Ian Cole (again) 2014-2015
glen a richter
Hockey God
Hockey God
 
Posts: 7269
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby cardsfan04 » Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:14 pm

I don't know what to make of it, but I've noticed everything Hitch says about injuries is extremely calculated. It could be that 2-3 games is true, or it could be that he thinks saying 2-3 games helps us somehow. Hell, maybe Backes will be back tomorrow night and nobody will know until he takes the ice.
2010-2011 Official LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk
cardsfan04
All-Star
All-Star
 
Posts: 2384
Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 12:43 am

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby glen a richter » Tue Apr 22, 2014 6:24 pm

@PietrangeloNews tweeted that Backes may be back tomorrow. I'm calling it right now: that's pure and utter bullshit. Hitch knows it, Backes knows it and the Blackhawks know it.
LGB sponsor of Ian Cole 2011-2012
LGB sponsor of Gary Bettman's Pink Slip 2013
LGB sponsor of Dmitrij Jaskin 2013-2014
LGB sponsor of Ian Cole (again) 2014-2015
glen a richter
Hockey God
Hockey God
 
Posts: 7269
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby Toasted Oates » Tue Apr 22, 2014 7:10 pm

I think 42 may surprise us and return tomorrow night. Hitchcock was asked about lineup changes and said, "Tomorrow? Ah...maybe. Maybe. We'll see." Maybe bullshit.....maybe not. Also, JR said Backes' chances of playing are better than 50/50. Again, maybe bullshit....maybe not. On my drive home yesterday, I heard John Kelly say he talked to 42 and he seemed perfectly fine. Also, he flew to Chicago with the team which is common knowledge at this point. The hit looked catastrophic, but maybe the loving bosom of the Scottrade boards absorbed some of the impact.

They'll have to lock him in a United Center closet to keep him off the ice. This is a big time game tomorrow night. Could be totally wrong, and I'm cool with eating crow. But the ole (occasionally mistaken) gut tells me he plays.
User avatar
Toasted Oates
3rd Line Grinder
3rd Line Grinder
 
Posts: 135
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:59 pm

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby Kerfuffle » Tue Apr 22, 2014 7:24 pm

I think Backes is done for the season and you'll be lucky to see him for opening night in October. That hit was nasty and when he stood up you could tell he was out of it and that was scary. Hossa had a bad hit from Torres 2 years ago and was out for 9 months. I think it's unlikely Backes is back for the playoffs this season. Granted everyone's body is different and it's impossible to tell how bad his brain was bruised in that hit - that's why time is needed to tell. I think it's all too risky to his life to rush him back out there. Despite the fact that both teams each want to win Backes life is more important than the Stanley Cup.
User avatar
Kerfuffle
3rd Line Grinder
3rd Line Grinder
 
Posts: 129
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby Kerfuffle » Tue Apr 22, 2014 7:28 pm

not_a_wings_fan wrote:
Kerfuffle wrote:I have been shocked by how little Chicago has been pressing with the lead. Seems like they are playing prevent defense am that usually only prevents you from winning. No doubt Chicago has a stronger top six forwards, but so far it's the defense clearing out picks that's saving these games from being laughers.

Game 4 is huge. If stl wins, I don't think they lose game 5 at home. If chi wins, I don't like stl's chances in a best of three even with two games is our barn.

It's an entertaining series, no doubt.

That's true - and you guys are out-intensifying us. We saw it in the 2010-2011 season (stanley cup hangover) and see it again this season as well. As a fan it's frustrating cause I know the Hawks are capable of more but the hunger is lost. One thing that was VERY noticeable in game 3 is that your players are hungry for a cup and the intensity was at a higher level than ours. That doesn't mean the Hawks can't win but I would rather we had that intensity cause we had it the 2 years we won the cup and 'wanting it more than the other guy' is critical.
User avatar
Kerfuffle
3rd Line Grinder
3rd Line Grinder
 
Posts: 129
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby Toasted Oates » Tue Apr 22, 2014 7:45 pm

Kerfuffle wrote:I think Backes is done for the season and you'll be lucky to see him for opening night in October. That hit was nasty and when he stood up you could tell he was out of it and that was scary. Hossa had a bad hit from Torres 2 years ago and was out for 9 months. I think it's unlikely Backes is back for the playoffs this season. Granted everyone's body is different and it's impossible to tell how bad his brain was bruised in that hit - that's why time is needed to tell. I think it's all too risky to his life to rush him back out there. Despite the fact that both teams each want to win Backes life is more important than the Stanley Cup.

This is the consensus, I'm sure. Nobody knows how bad he's hurt, though. You mentioned Hossa--I remember reading a quote where he said he laid in bed for 3 days in the dark after the injury. Backes hopped on a plane with his teammates. I just don't believe that would be allowed if he was even mildly concussed. That could be insanity and you may be right (Hawk fandom aside). Time will tell.
User avatar
Toasted Oates
3rd Line Grinder
3rd Line Grinder
 
Posts: 135
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:59 pm

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby Oaklandblue » Wed Apr 23, 2014 12:04 am

Toasted Oates wrote:I think 42 may surprise us and return tomorrow night. Hitchcock was asked about lineup changes and said, "Tomorrow? Ah...maybe. Maybe. We'll see." Maybe bullshit.....maybe not. Also, JR said Backes' chances of playing are better than 50/50. Again, maybe bullshit....maybe not. On my drive home yesterday, I heard John Kelly say he talked to 42 and he seemed perfectly fine. Also, he flew to Chicago with the team which is common knowledge at this point. The hit looked catastrophic, but maybe the loving bosom of the Scottrade boards absorbed some of the impact.

They'll have to lock him in a United Center closet to keep him off the ice. This is a big time game tomorrow night. Could be totally wrong, and I'm cool with eating crow. But the ole (occasionally mistaken) gut tells me he plays.


I'm with Toasts, Backes will be back for Game 4. This team is made up of warriors.
2014-2015 LGB Sponsor of Patrik "No-Timer" Berglund
2013-2014 LGB Sponsor of Derek "In The Middle" Roy
2012-2013 LGB Sponsor of Chris "NO SLEEP TIL THE CUP!" Stewart - Shhhhh!!!
Oaklandblue
1st Line Sniper
1st Line Sniper
 
Posts: 751
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2011 11:20 pm

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby Kerfuffle » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:05 am

Oaklandblue wrote:
Toasted Oates wrote:They'll have to lock him in a United Center closet to keep him off the ice. This is a big time game tomorrow night. Could be totally wrong, and I'm cool with eating crow. But the ole (occasionally mistaken) gut tells me he plays.


I'm with Toasts, Backes will be back for Game 4. This team is made up of warriors.


I don't see how that happens. And if it did it would make me questionable the team doctor's decision and whether Backes was faking the injury. I don't believe he was and when you replay the incident and see him stand up he looks completely out of it and dazed and that is a sign of concussion. It would be irresponsible to put him back out there. You can call him a warrior but he's as human as you and I and the human brain when rocked inside a skull gets bruised and a person's toughness has nothing to do with it.
User avatar
Kerfuffle
3rd Line Grinder
3rd Line Grinder
 
Posts: 129
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby cprice12 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:10 am

Kerfuffle wrote:I think Backes is done for the season and you'll be lucky to see him for opening night in October. That hit was nasty and when he stood up you could tell he was out of it and that was scary. Hossa had a bad hit from Torres 2 years ago and was out for 9 months. I think it's unlikely Backes is back for the playoffs this season. Granted everyone's body is different and it's impossible to tell how bad his brain was bruised in that hit - that's why time is needed to tell. I think it's all too risky to his life to rush him back out there. Despite the fact that both teams each want to win Backes life is more important than the Stanley Cup.


Everyone is different. Every hit is different.
The hit looked nasty as hell...and he was knocked out and was certainly woozy when he jumped up. But he didn't lay there on the ice motionless. He didn't need two guys holding each arm as he skated off.
He got up, very shakily, but he got up and was yelling at everyone, and he skated off with little help. He then got on the plane to Chicago that night. Which I thought was encouraging at the time. He wouldn't have flown if his concussion was severe.
He wasn't forced to lay down in a dark room for days, he apparently isn't suffering any significant (or any) post concussion syndrome symptoms...but I guess we don't know for sure either way.
The helmet could have done it's job, for the most part...maybe.
I'm just going to wait and see. Making any proclamations about him being done for the season or not is pure speculation at best.
Typical rest/recovery for a standard/mild concussion is approx 6 days...according to the Mayo Clinic. I would have thought more...but I'm not a doctor either.
I don't know why Hitch would say he'd be back in 2-3 days if he wasn't told that...you'd think that would be a let down for everyone if he isn't back in 2-3 days. But then again, I'm not sure why he would volunteer that info either. You'd think it would be nice to play possum and spring that on the Hawks during the pre-game skate the day he is to come back.

Based on how they are talking (unless you want to play the role of pessimistic pretend doctor), I'd expect Backes back rather soon. And if he comes back before Seabrook...that's a huge plus for the Blues.
Image
Image

2014-2015 Sponsor -- Blues Asst. Coach Kirk Muller
User avatar
cprice12
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 19534
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 1:26 am
Location: Center Ice

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby goon attack » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:14 am

I think his neck is what kept him out. I think if he's not back tonight, he's defintely back by Game 5. But we may see him tonight.
Official '14-'15 sponsor of the $17.8+ trillion U.S. national debt.
Past Sponsorships: '13-'14 another season of bitter disappointment; '13: communism; 11-'12: Vlad Sobotka and fake, drunken lesbianism; 10-'11: Ryan Reaves, Bo Derek's cans, Willow Palin, and the new Lightning logo; 09-'10: the epic destruction of the Politics Forum; 08-'09: Sandy Miller
User avatar
goon attack
Hockey God
Hockey God
 
Posts: 17073
Joined: Fri Feb 21, 2003 2:18 pm

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby cprice12 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:20 am

goon attack wrote:I think his neck is what kept him out. I think if he's not back tonight, he's defintely back by Game 5. But we may see him tonight.


There were comments about his neck that I heard as well...which again, encouraging that it may not be his brain.
Image
Image

2014-2015 Sponsor -- Blues Asst. Coach Kirk Muller
User avatar
cprice12
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 19534
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 1:26 am
Location: Center Ice

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby cprice12 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 7:28 am

Kerfuffle wrote:
Oaklandblue wrote:
Toasted Oates wrote:They'll have to lock him in a United Center closet to keep him off the ice. This is a big time game tomorrow night. Could be totally wrong, and I'm cool with eating crow. But the ole (occasionally mistaken) gut tells me he plays.


I'm with Toasts, Backes will be back for Game 4. This team is made up of warriors.


I don't see how that happens. And if it did it would make me questionable the team doctor's decision and whether Backes was faking the injury. I don't believe he was and when you replay the incident and see him stand up he looks completely out of it and dazed and that is a sign of concussion. It would be irresponsible to put him back out there. You can call him a warrior but he's as human as you and I and the human brain when rocked inside a skull gets bruised and a person's toughness has nothing to do with it.


There are different levels of concussions.
Just because Hossa had one and was messed up for a while, doesn't mean that is the case with everyone. Pronger has had severe symptoms for years now. Perron missed almost a year. Oshie missed a week (and many other players have missed a week or so as well). It just depends on how bad the concussion is and how quickly a player recovers.

But I agree with you on one thing...if Backes is still suffering from concussion symptoms, he shouldn't be playing, and there is no way the team would play him if that were the case. Playing with a concussion can mess you up for life...which is what happened with Pronger. Pronger played a few games with a concussion...didn't tell anyone he had it.

If Backes passed his baseline concussion test, then all he needs is medical clearance from the team doctors before he plays.
Image
Image

2014-2015 Sponsor -- Blues Asst. Coach Kirk Muller
User avatar
cprice12
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 19534
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 1:26 am
Location: Center Ice

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby Kerfuffle » Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:02 am

cprice12 wrote:
Kerfuffle wrote:
Oaklandblue wrote:
Toasted Oates wrote:If Backes passed his baseline concussion test, then all he needs is medical clearance from the team doctors before he plays.

Yeah but what doctor in his right mind would clear him to play tonight after only 48 hours after the injury? That's a pretty big risk and definitely not one I would want to take on. Huge liability for that doctor as well if Backes has issues.
User avatar
Kerfuffle
3rd Line Grinder
3rd Line Grinder
 
Posts: 129
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby cprice12 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:45 am

Kerfuffle wrote:
cprice12 wrote:
Kerfuffle wrote:
Oaklandblue wrote:
Toasted Oates wrote:If Backes passed his baseline concussion test, then all he needs is medical clearance from the team doctors before he plays.

Yeah but what doctor in his right mind would clear him to play tonight after only 48 hours after the injury? That's a pretty big risk and definitely not one I would want to take on. Huge liability for that doctor as well if Backes has issues.


It hasn't been 48 hours since the injury... that hit happened around 4:30pm on Saturday. Game time tonight will be about 102 hours...just over 4 days.

If he is fine to play, he'll play. If he's not, he won't.

There is no need to rush him back anyway. It's not a must win game for the Blues. Sure, they'd love to win this one...but even if we lose this one, we still have home ice advantage.

I'm not a doctor, nor am I a member of the Blues training or medical staff... so anything I say is speculative. Same goes for you.

Like I said, if he passed his concussion test, that means the NHL will allow him to play...it's just up to the Blues doctors if he is fit otherwise to play...and speculation is that his neck is why he was kept out of game #3. I guess it's possible he didn't suffer a concussion, even though it certainly appeared he did. Nobody has come out and said it was a concussion.

John Kelly said he thinks there is a good chance Backes will play...but we'll know for sure after the 11:30 skate.
To me, that says he either didn't have a concussion (which is hard to believe), or it was very minor. That is, assuming the Blues aren't blowing smoke to screw with the Blackhawk's mindset and gameplan.
Image
Image

2014-2015 Sponsor -- Blues Asst. Coach Kirk Muller
User avatar
cprice12
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 19534
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 1:26 am
Location: Center Ice

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby not_a_wings_fan » Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:48 am

Kerfuffle wrote:
Oaklandblue wrote:
Toasted Oates wrote:They'll have to lock him in a United Center closet to keep him off the ice. This is a big time game tomorrow night. Could be totally wrong, and I'm cool with eating crow. But the ole (occasionally mistaken) gut tells me he plays.


I'm with Toasts, Backes will be back for Game 4. This team is made up of warriors.


I don't see how that happens. And if it did it would make me questionable the team doctor's decision and whether Backes was faking the injury. I don't believe he was and when you replay the incident and see him stand up he looks completely out of it and dazed and that is a sign of concussion. It would be irresponsible to put him back out there. You can call him a warrior but he's as human as you and I and the human brain when rocked inside a skull gets bruised and a person's toughness has nothing to do with it.


I would be concerned if Backes is back this soon. I really want him to play, but the long-term consequences of a too soon return to the game could be devastating to the player and the franchise.

Everyone heals differently, so there's every chance that he's okay to play. I just would be patient if it was my call.
Official 2008-2014 LGB Sponsor of Barret Jackman
Official 2014-2015 LGB Sponsor of Barret Jackman
User avatar
not_a_wings_fan
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame
 
Posts: 3098
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 1:27 pm
Location: Anywhere but here

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby not_a_wings_fan » Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:53 am

cprice12 wrote:
Kerfuffle wrote:
cprice12 wrote:
Kerfuffle wrote:
Oaklandblue wrote:
Toasted Oates wrote:If Backes passed his baseline concussion test, then all he needs is medical clearance from the team doctors before he plays.

Yeah but what doctor in his right mind would clear him to play tonight after only 48 hours after the injury? That's a pretty big risk and definitely not one I would want to take on. Huge liability for that doctor as well if Backes has issues.


It hasn't been 48 hours since the injury... that hit happened around 4:30pm on Saturday. Game time tonight will be about 102 hours...just over 4 days.

If he is fine to play, he'll play. If he's not, he won't.

There is no need to rush him back anyway. It's not a must win game for the Blues. Sure, they'd love to win this one...but even if we lose this one, we still have home ice advantage.

I'm not a doctor, nor am I a member of the Blues training or medical staff... so anything I say is speculative. Same goes for you.

Like I said, if he passed his concussion test, that means the NHL will allow him to play...it's just up to the Blues doctors if he is fit otherwise to play...and speculation is that his neck is why he was kept out of game #3. I guess it's possible he didn't suffer a concussion, even though it certainly appeared he did. Nobody has come out and said it was a concussion.

John Kelly said he thinks there is a good chance Backes will play...but we'll know for sure after the 11:30 skate.
To me, that says he either didn't have a concussion (which is hard to believe), or it was very minor. That is, assuming the Blues aren't blowing smoke to screw with the Blackhawk's mindset and gameplan.

Curt, there is no way on the green earth of God that he was not at least mildly concussed on that play. He lost consciousness and displayed problems with balance after the hit. By definition, there is at least a mild brain injury.
Official 2008-2014 LGB Sponsor of Barret Jackman
Official 2014-2015 LGB Sponsor of Barret Jackman
User avatar
not_a_wings_fan
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame
 
Posts: 3098
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2005 1:27 pm
Location: Anywhere but here

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby cprice12 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 9:32 am

not_a_wings_fan wrote:Curt, there is no way on the green earth of God that he was not at least mildly concussed on that play. He lost consciousness and displayed problems with balance after the hit. By definition, there is at least a mild brain injury.

I would be inclined to agree with you. But they haven't come out and said it was a concussion or not...so we don't know for sure.
If he did suffer a concussion, he is apparently symptom free today if the are considering playing him. And he must have passed his baseline concussion test, because you have to do so in order to be cleared to play anyway.

Oshie looked the same as Backes, needed help getting off the ice, looked dazed, may have lost consciousness, etc. And he passed his baseline concussion test. Which really only means that his concussion test matched his baseline test that is administered before the season... AND that he was not suffering concusion-like symptoms. And he was only out a little over a week.

I am inclined to believe he was held out of game #3 because of a neck issue, not because of concussion symptoms.
Image
Image

2014-2015 Sponsor -- Blues Asst. Coach Kirk Muller
User avatar
cprice12
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 19534
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 1:26 am
Location: Center Ice

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby Kerfuffle » Wed Apr 23, 2014 9:59 am

One hard hit and he could be gone a lot longer than the playoffs. Teams are always secretive during the playoffs cause they don't want to tip their game plan to the opponent. Even in the Finals last year both us and the Bruins had guys with broken bones, collapsed lungs, etc still playing and nothing was revealed until after the series was over.
User avatar
Kerfuffle
3rd Line Grinder
3rd Line Grinder
 
Posts: 129
Joined: Tue Apr 22, 2014 8:18 am

Re: Blues vs. Blackhawks Round 1 Discussion Thread

Postby sseagle » Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:25 am

Kerfuffle wrote:One hard hit and he could be gone a lot longer than the playoffs. Teams are always secretive during the playoffs cause they don't want to tip their game plan to the opponent. Even in the Finals last year both us and the Bruins had guys with broken bones, collapsed lungs, etc still playing and nothing was revealed until after the series was over.


You seem to want Backes out longer than Seabrook... Oh you are a hawks fan.
Official Chatzy Sponsor Extraordinaire - Just wait till we score four...

Official Sponsor of FlashChat.. why am I alone still?

Image
User avatar
sseagle
All-Star
All-Star
 
Posts: 2116
Joined: Thu Jun 22, 2006 9:03 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO

PreviousNext

Return to St. Louis Blues Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 3 guests

cron