Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3 yrs

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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby ComradeT » Sat Jul 19, 2014 8:20 pm

ViPeRx007 wrote:
APOD wrote:
ComradeT wrote:Just read an article in the Russian press that quoted the Avangard Omsk president as saying Boat would not be paid nowhere near $4mil. It is indeed a 3-year deal with an option to return to the NHL after one season. At the same time, other sources say that Boat believes Avangard is genuinely interested in him. Looks like he wasn't after the money after all.


???? So is he 100% signed with Omsk then? or is their deal not done yet either? Thats (Frank) confusing, I would rather him not come back anyway, but maybe we can trade his rights away for decent return if its 100% he will come back to whatever team we deal him to.


The NHL should really have something written into contracts that prevent players from just bolting to other countries and holding themselves for ransom. If he was a UFA, fine, but he was an RFA. No other NHL team could pursue him, at least until after arbitration and only when we cut them free (if my understanding is correct), but I guess Russian teams can? He's still under the Blues control as of right now, so why is he signing another contract and playing for a different team?

I guess I just don't understand all the details of player contracts but it doesn't seem quite right to me. I always liked Sobotka, but he suddenly seems to have a really big head. He's a good player, but it's not like he's irreplaceable.


Yeah, this is not very good, and while KHL is not subject to NHL's contractual rules, the NHL players should be. This loophole seems to have existed for quite some time, giving roots to the "Russian factor" phenomenon. Not sure if there's a way to mitigate this, but seems like having a year on the contract with a 27-year old Boat is quite different from the same situation with a 30-year old Boat, and there should be compensation from KHL (probably cash).

Does the NHL poach European players the same way? I know Europeans enter the draft and such but can they come to NHL mid-contract or does that happen once the contract is up?
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby glen a richter » Sat Jul 19, 2014 8:44 pm

Compensation should simply be we (or whoever) gets control of one of the KHL players for the duration that the NHL player is over there.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby Oaklandblue » Sat Jul 19, 2014 8:57 pm

ComradeT wrote:Just read an article in the Russian press that quoted the Avangard Omsk president as saying Boat would not be paid nowhere near $4mil. It is indeed a 3-year deal with an option to return to the NHL after one season. At the same time, other sources say that Boat believes Avangard is genuinely interested in him. Looks like he wasn't after the money after all.


So Army, what REALLY happened at those talks with Boat?
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby Jackman5 » Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:37 am

When is the Sobotka statue joining Federko, MacInnis and Hull outside Scottrade?
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby cardsfan04 » Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:24 am

Oaklandblue wrote:
ComradeT wrote:Just read an article in the Russian press that quoted the Avangard Omsk president as saying Boat would not be paid nowhere near $4mil. It is indeed a 3-year deal with an option to return to the NHL after one season. At the same time, other sources say that Boat believes Avangard is genuinely interested in him. Looks like he wasn't after the money after all.


So Army, what REALLY happened at those talks with Boat?


Maybe I'm naive or gullible or something, but I don't think Army would have come out and been as specific as he was if he was lying.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby goon attack » Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:02 pm

Screw Sobotka. I liked him and loved his attitude and willingness to fight, but throwing down 5 times per season isn't anything to jump for joy over.

However, We have now lost THREE guys who are willing to fight. I guess we're trying to ice dance our way to the Cup like Detroit and Chicago. :facepalm:

How utterly freaking boring. :x
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby ViPeRx007 » Sun Jul 20, 2014 11:30 pm

goon attack wrote:Screw Sobotka. I liked him and loved his attitude and willingness to fight, but throwing down 5 times per season isn't anything to jump for joy over.

However, We have now lost THREE guys who are willing to fight. I guess we're trying to ice dance our way to the Cup like Detroit and Chicago. :facepalm:

How utterly freaking boring. :x


Maybe Lehtera will beat some ass?

LOL.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby dmiles2186 » Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:31 am

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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby ecbm » Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:59 am

goon attack wrote:Screw Sobotka. I liked him and loved his attitude and willingness to fight, but throwing down 5 times per season isn't anything to jump for joy over.

However, We have now lost THREE guys who are willing to fight. I guess we're trying to ice dance our way to the Cup like Detroit and Chicago. :facepalm:

How utterly freaking boring. :x


Hey, don't worry. Reaves will fight at least twice, Ott will say mean things to guys as they skate past him and Lapierre will hack everything in sight, so we're good...
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby cprice12 » Mon Jul 21, 2014 11:23 am

ecbm wrote:
goon attack wrote:Screw Sobotka. I liked him and loved his attitude and willingness to fight, but throwing down 5 times per season isn't anything to jump for joy over.

However, We have now lost THREE guys who are willing to fight. I guess we're trying to ice dance our way to the Cup like Detroit and Chicago. :facepalm:

How utterly freaking boring. :x


Hey, don't worry. Reaves will fight at least twice, Ott will say mean things to guys as they skate past him and Lapierre will hack everything in sight, so we're good...


And if we can win a cup doing that... that's perfectly fine by me....and I'll ask why we didn't do that sooner.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby drwoland » Mon Jul 21, 2014 4:43 pm

Based on the Omsk GM's comments calling Sobotka's 4m salary "tall tales," as well as some of Army's comments, I am guessing what happened is this: Sobotka wanted to be treated as a 2nd line guy on the Blues and be paid accordingly. When that didn't pan out, he got a credible offer from a KHL team and then inflated the salary he was being offered. The Blues thought "Well, if we concede every time someone threatens to go to the KHL, then Schwartz, Tank, and literally everyone else will just do the same thing, so we have to make it clear that we will not be bluffed." So they said "Go for it." And now Sobotka has to go play in the Russian heartland, just north of Kazakhstan for presumably much less than $4m/year, but the Blues come out as an organization not to be trifled with.

I'll take it. Here's to a breakout year for Ott, Berglund, and Lehtera.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby ViPeRx007 » Mon Jul 21, 2014 7:20 pm

drwoland wrote:Based on the Omsk GM's comments calling Sobotka's 4m salary "tall tales," as well as some of Army's comments, I am guessing what happened is this: Sobotka wanted to be treated as a 2nd line guy on the Blues and be paid accordingly. When that didn't pan out, he got a credible offer from a KHL team and then inflated the salary he was being offered. The Blues thought "Well, if we concede every time someone threatens to go to the KHL, then Schwartz, Tank, and literally everyone else will just do the same thing, so we have to make it clear that we will not be bluffed." So they said "Go for it." And now Sobotka has to go play in the Russian heartland, just north of Kazakhstan for presumably much less than $4m/year, but the Blues come out as an organization not to be trifled with.

I'll take it. Here's to a breakout year for Ott, Berglund, and Lehtera.


Sobotka is going to feel pretty dumb when we're hoisting the cup next summer and he's flying around in secondhand planes getting paid in peanuts.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby not_a_wings_fan » Mon Jul 21, 2014 7:50 pm

ViPeRx007 wrote:
drwoland wrote:Based on the Omsk GM's comments calling Sobotka's 4m salary "tall tales," as well as some of Army's comments, I am guessing what happened is this: Sobotka wanted to be treated as a 2nd line guy on the Blues and be paid accordingly. When that didn't pan out, he got a credible offer from a KHL team and then inflated the salary he was being offered. The Blues thought "Well, if we concede every time someone threatens to go to the KHL, then Schwartz, Tank, and literally everyone else will just do the same thing, so we have to make it clear that we will not be bluffed." So they said "Go for it." And now Sobotka has to go play in the Russian heartland, just north of Kazakhstan for presumably much less than $4m/year, but the Blues come out as an organization not to be trifled with.

I'll take it. Here's to a breakout year for Ott, Berglund, and Lehtera.


Sobotka is going to feel pretty dumb when we're hoisting the cup next summer and he's falling out of the sky in secondhand planes or getting shot down by Ukrainian rebels.
Fixed for accuracy.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby ViPeRx007 » Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:11 pm

not_a_wings_fan wrote:
ViPeRx007 wrote:
drwoland wrote:Based on the Omsk GM's comments calling Sobotka's 4m salary "tall tales," as well as some of Army's comments, I am guessing what happened is this: Sobotka wanted to be treated as a 2nd line guy on the Blues and be paid accordingly. When that didn't pan out, he got a credible offer from a KHL team and then inflated the salary he was being offered. The Blues thought "Well, if we concede every time someone threatens to go to the KHL, then Schwartz, Tank, and literally everyone else will just do the same thing, so we have to make it clear that we will not be bluffed." So they said "Go for it." And now Sobotka has to go play in the Russian heartland, just north of Kazakhstan for presumably much less than $4m/year, but the Blues come out as an organization not to be trifled with.

I'll take it. Here's to a breakout year for Ott, Berglund, and Lehtera.


Sobotka is going to feel pretty dumb when we're hoisting the cup next summer and he's falling out of the sky in secondhand planes or getting shot down by Ukrainian rebels.
Fixed for accuracy.


I actually had something like that typed out but felt sort of bad about posting it. :lol:
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby glen a richter » Mon Jul 21, 2014 8:12 pm

not_a_wings_fan wrote:
ViPeRx007 wrote:
drwoland wrote:Based on the Omsk GM's comments calling Sobotka's 4m salary "tall tales," as well as some of Army's comments, I am guessing what happened is this: Sobotka wanted to be treated as a 2nd line guy on the Blues and be paid accordingly. When that didn't pan out, he got a credible offer from a KHL team and then inflated the salary he was being offered. The Blues thought "Well, if we concede every time someone threatens to go to the KHL, then Schwartz, Tank, and literally everyone else will just do the same thing, so we have to make it clear that we will not be bluffed." So they said "Go for it." And now Sobotka has to go play in the Russian heartland, just north of Kazakhstan for presumably much less than $4m/year, but the Blues come out as an organization not to be trifled with.

I'll take it. Here's to a breakout year for Ott, Berglund, and Lehtera.


Sobotka is going to feel pretty dumb when we're hoisting the cup next summer and he's falling out of the sky in secondhand planes or getting shot down by Ukrainian rebels.
Fixed for accuracy.


Too soon bro, too soon.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby flyingnote38 » Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:12 pm

the additional info seems to support my assumption that Sobotka was more upset over his to be role than the money(reportedly requested a trade over $300K difference).

Not a smart move by him. To come back to the NHL, he has to play a season for $2.75 Mill now whenever that is. Had he taken the $2.7 Million offer, he'd be an UFA next summer.

Looks like trade will be the Blues best option....maybe we can have a double do-over with Boston and deal them Sobotka and the theoretical rights to Toivonen for Soderberg and Warsofsky.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby not_a_wings_fan » Mon Jul 21, 2014 9:25 pm

glen a richter wrote:
not_a_wings_fan wrote:
ViPeRx007 wrote:
drwoland wrote:Based on the Omsk GM's comments calling Sobotka's 4m salary "tall tales," as well as some of Army's comments, I am guessing what happened is this: Sobotka wanted to be treated as a 2nd line guy on the Blues and be paid accordingly. When that didn't pan out, he got a credible offer from a KHL team and then inflated the salary he was being offered. The Blues thought "Well, if we concede every time someone threatens to go to the KHL, then Schwartz, Tank, and literally everyone else will just do the same thing, so we have to make it clear that we will not be bluffed." So they said "Go for it." And now Sobotka has to go play in the Russian heartland, just north of Kazakhstan for presumably much less than $4m/year, but the Blues come out as an organization not to be trifled with.

I'll take it. Here's to a breakout year for Ott, Berglund, and Lehtera.


Sobotka is going to feel pretty dumb when we're hoisting the cup next summer and he's falling out of the sky in secondhand planes or getting shot down by Ukrainian rebels.
Fixed for accuracy.


Too soon bro, too soon.
...it's just truth.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby Oaklandblue » Tue Jul 22, 2014 6:52 am

dmiles2186 wrote:
Oaklandblue wrote:I honestly don't see it in the cards.


Oaklandblue is Miss Cleo?

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I'll take a stab at this: I predict Leopold won't be a Blue much longer.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby JCShutout » Tue Jul 22, 2014 7:24 am

Sounds like the guy just didn't want to be here. (Or rather, didn't want the proper role here) In which case, nice knowing ya. He's a fine player, and is passable on the 2nd line as injury replacement, but he's a 3rd liner at heart, and if he wants a bigger role than that, then he's not going to be on a winner in the NHL.
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Re: Blues re-sign Steve Ott, 2 yrs; Sobotka to Omsk (KHL), 3

Postby ecbm » Tue Jul 22, 2014 9:40 am

cprice12 wrote:
ecbm wrote:
goon attack wrote:Screw Sobotka. I liked him and loved his attitude and willingness to fight, but throwing down 5 times per season isn't anything to jump for joy over.

However, We have now lost THREE guys who are willing to fight. I guess we're trying to ice dance our way to the Cup like Detroit and Chicago. :facepalm:

How utterly freaking boring. :x


Hey, don't worry. Reaves will fight at least twice, Ott will say mean things to guys as they skate past him and Lapierre will hack everything in sight, so we're good...


And if we can win a cup doing that... that's perfectly fine by me....and I'll ask why we didn't do that sooner.


Oh, so will I. The Cardinals have a great record of making me look like an idiot for criticizing them. Would love for the Blues to join them.
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