World Cup 2014

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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 12:24 pm

JesusNEVERexisted wrote:Thanks for clearing that up guys. I understand better BUT you know the biggest complaint about soccer is it's too slow and low scoring. So WHY have these rules that slow the game down even more and stifle the offense?

I have been watching the World Cup highlights and I don't think I've seen a single breakaway this tournament!!


But who is complaining? Just America, that's it. The entire rest of the planet is perfectly fine with the game as it is. I choose to look at it a different way. It places emphasis on actually cashing in your chances. A sport like basketball, where you score once every minute or so, a missed chance isn't that painful. In soccer, it's gut wrenching (see: Bradley, Michael yesterday).

It's like a board game. It's very methodical and it may be slow at times, but you are moving the pieces in a certain place or order to try to make your big move. It makes every 'big move' crucial. You have to hit on it, if you don't, you've got to find another way to come at it. Maybe it's not a good analogy, but I find the fact that it's low scoring to be perfectly fine.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby JesusNEVERexisted » Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:19 pm

The TV audience has been amazing. It seems 18 million saw the U.S./Portugal game but let's be honest here. It's because it's the WORLD CUP, the biggest event on earth! They got a bigger crowd than the NBA finals, World Series, or Stanley Cup!

MLS ratings haven't improved significantly since the league began in 1996. The Washington Post even had an article titled Nobody watches MLS. So Americans can go back to ignoring soccer after the World Cup!
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:47 am

JesusNEVERexisted wrote:The TV audience has been amazing. It seems 18 million saw the U.S./Portugal game but let's be honest here. It's because it's the WORLD CUP, the biggest event on earth! They got a bigger crowd than the NBA finals, World Series, or Stanley Cup!

MLS ratings haven't improved significantly since the league began in 1996. The Washington Post even had an article titled Nobody watches MLS. So Americans can go back to ignoring soccer after the World Cup!


TV ratings are low for MLS, sure. There's a few reasons for that. One being that the quality of play is better elsewhere. You can cite MLS ratings, but you have to mention that EPL ratings have gone up steadily over the years, if I'm not mistaken. People are watching soccer, just not our own domestic league. Another cause for this is there is no steady time that these games are on nationally. Back when I first started watching MLS, they would have a 'Game of the Week' every Saturday afternoon on ESPN or ABC. But now, some ESPN games are on Saturday afternoons, some late Sunday night, some one Friday nights on NBCSN, some on Saturday nights on NBCSN, there isn't a constant. It's hard to find. I hope this will be cleaned up a bit better with the next TV contract which, if memory serves, is being split between ESPN and Fox/Fox Sports 1. And I don't know if you've seen the numbers, but the new TV contract the MLS just signed with these networks was quite substantial for the ratings they pull in. The networks see the potential there.

I should also note that the attendance at MLS games has risen steadily. Ever since Columbus built the first soccer specific stadium (SSS), it's caused other teams to do the same. Not to mention that Seattle averages 30,000+ every single match. So there is a fan base there, for sure. Kansas City sells out every game. If you've never seen a Portland Timbers match, you should do that right now. Even just on TV, their crowd makes the game worth watching. So yeah, you can cite ratings, but you are missing the larger picture. MLS has changed immensely (for the better) in the last 6-7 years (starting w/ Beckham) and is only getting better.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby JesusNEVERexisted » Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:41 am

Dmiles, I'll bet you anything MLS won't ever have a national footprint like the other 4 sports do. MLS Cup won't ever be in prime time on a major over the air network like ABC, NBC, or CBS.

You must remember even established sports leagues like NBA and MLB have lost viewers because there are so many more media outlets these days and that will only get bigger in the future. There is just no room for MLS.

There MAY be a possible exception if MLS could lure a major star like Ronaldo while he's still close to his prime but I really doubt that will happen.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:02 am

JesusNEVERexisted wrote:Dmiles, I'll bet you anything MLS won't ever have a national footprint like the other 4 sports do. MLS Cup won't ever be in prime time on a major over the air network like ABC, NBC, or CBS.

You must remember even established sports leagues like NBA and MLB have lost viewers because there are so many more media outlets these days and that will only get bigger in the future. There is just no room for MLS.

There MAY be a possible exception if MLS could lure a major star like Ronaldo while he's still close to his prime but I really doubt that will happen.


I agree with you on most of this. I never said MLS would be in the 'big 4,' but my hope is that it will be some day. That's just me being optimistic. You're right, there isn't much room, but that hasn't stopped the EPL gaining ground stateside (it also helps their games are on from 6 am-2 pm on Saturdays, when no other sports are on). But, I think you also have to be realistic. MLS is 18 years old. These leagues had quite a head start on it. Just after the turn of the millennium, MLS had to contract 2 teams and were down to the single digits in terms of teams. But since then, they've expanded and they're going to be up to 24 teams soon. That's phenomenal growth in a decade. My point is that you have to look at it differently than these other sports.

The wild card in all of this is football (American football). With all the brain injury information that's come out, fewer parents are letting their kids play football. Some of those kids are spilling to soccer. Yes, we've always been a 'we'll play soccer, but we won't watch it nation,' however, I think that tide is changing. I'm not saying this is something we'll see even in the next decade. But look at boxing. 2-3 decades ago, it was a behemoth sport. Now, no one pays attention. Part of that is when former champs turn into stuttering, shaky, mumbling shells of their former selves. Just like....football. Maybe it won't be soccer, but football will decline a bit and those people will turn their attention elsewhere.

Also, from 1996-2008, the MLS Cup was aired on ABC. It's since been aired on ESPN. I need to look up the TV deal, but I'm curious if Fox will take over or if the Cup will stay on ESPN over the next deal.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby not_a_wings_fan » Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:09 pm

I get it, most Americans don't like soccer. It really doesn't matter to me what "America" watches or thinks... I hate reality television but it's everywhere still. Great. Moving on.

The MLS is a shitty league. It has come a long way from the beginning, and has steadily improved the play, but it's not great soccer.

I really think USA soccer should start pushing more players overseas or outside the MLS if we have any hope of being successful internationally. Pushing players overseas has at least two major benefits: Our best players play against and train with the best players in the world AND it clears spaces in our professional league for other players to develop.

You are starting to see soccer academy teams after the European model spring up around the MLS (Sporting has a very successful one) and that will elevate the level of play significantly as time goes on. Training with professional coaches and players from a young age will lead to significantly more success.

There is a TON of cash to be had in soccer and I would bet that athletes from the USA will start to notice. Even Snoop tried to push his kid to soccer...

On topic:

Italy got totally (Frank) jobbed today. That was not a red card foul. That bite was clearly a red card worthy foul. Italy was dominating play when level, and the poor decisions by the referee directly altered the outcome. I am not going to say it's a conspiracy, but it was certainly poor showing.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby JesusNEVERexisted » Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:27 pm

Dmiles, I'd be shocked if EPL even gets a million viewers in America which means 99.7 % of Americans don't watch. What connection does your average American have to Everton, Portsmouth, or Liverpool? NONE!

Remember much of this cultural. I readily admit if I grew up in Europe or South America I would probably love soccer. The culture is very different in America and the vast majority of Americans don't watch soccer eventhough most of us played it growing up in school.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Tue Jun 24, 2014 5:16 pm

JesusNEVERexisted wrote:Dmiles, I'd be shocked if EPL even gets a million viewers in America which means 99.7 % of Americans don't watch. What connection does your average American have to Everton, Portsmouth, or Liverpool? NONE!

Remember much of this cultural. I readily admit if I grew up in Europe or South America I would probably love soccer. The culture is very different in America and the vast majority of Americans don't watch soccer eventhough most of us played it growing up in school.


I'm an Everton fan. There are tons of Liverpool fans. Americans are adopting teams because of players, how comparable they are to their own (American) sports teams, and the availability of their games on TV. I don't have any geographical connection to Everton (obviously), but I researched EPL teams and liked their history. I became a fan. I pull for them just as hard as any of my American teams. I've got a connection to them now, even across the ocean.

As for ratings, here's some stuff from Awful Announcing back in March that has some numbers. I wasn't able to find an average for the whole season. But keep in mind, these games start at 7 am eastern time, which is 4 am pacific. Half the country is asleep when these games start, but they still get good ratings for the time slot.

http://awfulannouncing.com/2014/nbc-boa ... story.html

February was a great month for NBC Sports. Aside from the obvious boost in ratings for the Winter Olympics, the network also boasted some truly impressive numbers for its coverage of the Premier League. Soccer coverage during the month of February was the most-watched in U.S. history.

Just how big were ratings? Pretty big, relatively speaking. A total of 17 Premier League games were shown across NBC, NBCSN and the USA Network and they brought in an average of 609,000 viewers per match. That's the second consecutive month NBC had a record EPL audience after averaging 492,000 viewers in January. Those numbers may sound insignificant, but they represent a 76% jump from the Premier League's previous best month back in September of 2011 which brought in an average of 346,000 viewers for 12 games shown on Fox, Fox Soccer and ESPN2.

The sudden spike in ratings can be attributed to one key factor: Olympic coverage.

NBCUniversal used lead-ins and promotion of the Premier League during Olympic events to bring a record number of eyes to the Premier League in the United States.

These numbers are noteworthy, but just about any program or event would have seen a big influx in viewers considering all of the lead-ins and promoting NBCUniversal gave during the Olympics. Still though, the Premier League is showing real growth in its first year on NBC and these numbers should give soccer fans real encouragement.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby sseagle » Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:32 pm

dmiles2186 wrote:
JesusNEVERexisted wrote:Dmiles, I'd be shocked if EPL even gets a million viewers in America which means 99.7 % of Americans don't watch. What connection does your average American have to Everton, Portsmouth, or Liverpool? NONE!

Remember much of this cultural. I readily admit if I grew up in Europe or South America I would probably love soccer. The culture is very different in America and the vast majority of Americans don't watch soccer eventhough most of us played it growing up in school.


I'm an Everton fan. There are tons of Liverpool fans. Americans are adopting teams because of players, how comparable they are to their own (American) sports teams, and the availability of their games on TV. I don't have any geographical connection to Everton (obviously), but I researched EPL teams and liked their history. I became a fan. I pull for them just as hard as any of my American teams. I've got a connection to them now, even across the ocean.

As for ratings, here's some stuff from Awful Announcing back in March that has some numbers. I wasn't able to find an average for the whole season. But keep in mind, these games start at 7 am eastern time, which is 4 am pacific. Half the country is asleep when these games start, but they still get good ratings for the time slot.

http://awfulannouncing.com/2014/nbc-boa ... story.html

February was a great month for NBC Sports. Aside from the obvious boost in ratings for the Winter Olympics, the network also boasted some truly impressive numbers for its coverage of the Premier League. Soccer coverage during the month of February was the most-watched in U.S. history.

Just how big were ratings? Pretty big, relatively speaking. A total of 17 Premier League games were shown across NBC, NBCSN and the USA Network and they brought in an average of 609,000 viewers per match. That's the second consecutive month NBC had a record EPL audience after averaging 492,000 viewers in January. Those numbers may sound insignificant, but they represent a 76% jump from the Premier League's previous best month back in September of 2011 which brought in an average of 346,000 viewers for 12 games shown on Fox, Fox Soccer and ESPN2.

The sudden spike in ratings can be attributed to one key factor: Olympic coverage.

NBCUniversal used lead-ins and promotion of the Premier League during Olympic events to bring a record number of eyes to the Premier League in the United States.

These numbers are noteworthy, but just about any program or event would have seen a big influx in viewers considering all of the lead-ins and promoting NBCUniversal gave during the Olympics. Still though, the Premier League is showing real growth in its first year on NBC and these numbers should give soccer fans real encouragement.


Frontrunning EPL fans are pussies...

My team just won the 5th tier of the english league, and will now be playing in League 2 in the autumn.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby ComradeT » Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:05 am

sseagle wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:
JesusNEVERexisted wrote:Dmiles, I'd be shocked if EPL even gets a million viewers in America which means 99.7 % of Americans don't watch. What connection does your average American have to Everton, Portsmouth, or Liverpool? NONE!

Remember much of this cultural. I readily admit if I grew up in Europe or South America I would probably love soccer. The culture is very different in America and the vast majority of Americans don't watch soccer eventhough most of us played it growing up in school.


I'm an Everton fan. There are tons of Liverpool fans. Americans are adopting teams because of players, how comparable they are to their own (American) sports teams, and the availability of their games on TV. I don't have any geographical connection to Everton (obviously), but I researched EPL teams and liked their history. I became a fan. I pull for them just as hard as any of my American teams. I've got a connection to them now, even across the ocean.

As for ratings, here's some stuff from Awful Announcing back in March that has some numbers. I wasn't able to find an average for the whole season. But keep in mind, these games start at 7 am eastern time, which is 4 am pacific. Half the country is asleep when these games start, but they still get good ratings for the time slot.

http://awfulannouncing.com/2014/nbc-boa ... story.html

February was a great month for NBC Sports. Aside from the obvious boost in ratings for the Winter Olympics, the network also boasted some truly impressive numbers for its coverage of the Premier League. Soccer coverage during the month of February was the most-watched in U.S. history.

Just how big were ratings? Pretty big, relatively speaking. A total of 17 Premier League games were shown across NBC, NBCSN and the USA Network and they brought in an average of 609,000 viewers per match. That's the second consecutive month NBC had a record EPL audience after averaging 492,000 viewers in January. Those numbers may sound insignificant, but they represent a 76% jump from the Premier League's previous best month back in September of 2011 which brought in an average of 346,000 viewers for 12 games shown on Fox, Fox Soccer and ESPN2.

The sudden spike in ratings can be attributed to one key factor: Olympic coverage.

NBCUniversal used lead-ins and promotion of the Premier League during Olympic events to bring a record number of eyes to the Premier League in the United States.

These numbers are noteworthy, but just about any program or event would have seen a big influx in viewers considering all of the lead-ins and promoting NBCUniversal gave during the Olympics. Still though, the Premier League is showing real growth in its first year on NBC and these numbers should give soccer fans real encouragement.


Frontrunning EPL fans are pussies...

My team just won the 5th tier of the english league, and will now be playing in League 2 in the autumn.
COME ON YOU HATTERS!


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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 6:41 am

Anyone else both really excited/feel the need to puke today? I'm off at 10:30 to go watch the match. COYY!
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:55 am

Suarez banned 9 games and 4 months by FIFA.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby JesusNEVERexisted » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:03 am

dmiles2186 wrote:Anyone else both really excited/feel the need to puke today? I'm off at 10:30 to go watch the match. COYY!


Where are you watching the game?

I'll be watching but I can never be THAT excited over soccer. Just wait till the World Cup is over then 99% of Americans will go back to ignoring soccer. Especially as the NFL and college football starts up which are the 2 biggest sports in America eventhough I'm not much of a fan of either.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:16 am

JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:Anyone else both really excited/feel the need to puke today? I'm off at 10:30 to go watch the match. COYY!


Where are you watching the game?

I'll be watching but I can never be THAT excited over soccer. Just wait till the World Cup is over then 99% of Americans will go back to ignoring soccer. Especially as the NFL and college football starts up which are the 2 biggest sports in America eventhough I'm not much of a fan of either.


Heading over to BWW's here in the town where I work to watch with some guys I work with.

As to your 2nd point, who cares? Some Americans have certainly become fans and will stick around. It's not unlike Americans who bail on hockey after the Olympics. In fact, it's the exact same thing. Sports with a small, dedicated following get talked about for a month while they're on the national stage, winning some fans, while the others go away. For others who stop caring, forget about them. They're missing out.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 2:10 pm

We made it through!
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby cardsfan04 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:10 pm

Unless Belgium loses (tied late in 1st half) and Algeria wins (losing in 1st half), we'll play Belgium. Would be really nice to win our next game and play Argentina. I'm guessing Argentina handles us easily, but would be fun to watch Messi play against the US, kinda.

One thing that's starting to annoy me though is all the laying on the field stuff. It seems like any time there is contact a player goes down and lays there until somebody gives them attention. I know that's a common criticism from the "We hate soccer" group (of which I am not a part), but it really does happen more than I care far.
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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby JesusNEVERexisted » Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:30 pm

dmiles2186 wrote:We made it through!


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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 3:36 pm

JesusNEVERexisted wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:We made it through!


What is BWW?


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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby Misc. Blues » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:30 pm

USA makes it though but Belgium will smoke us...

This World cup has been pretty good with so many teams hitting the back of the net. England is out which kind of sucks because half the Liverpool team was there.

I'm a huge Liverpool fan even if they are now owned by FSG (owners of the Boston Red Sox) but in my defense I was a fan before they were bought by FSG 5 years ago.

I'm glad people are taking an interest in football (soccer for Americans). I have been a fan since I was a kid when I played. St. Louis FC starts next year and can't wait.

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People who don't like football (soccer) have never clearly gave it a chance. MLS is a joke compared to Europe or South American football.

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Re: World Cup 2014

Postby dmiles2186 » Thu Jun 26, 2014 8:00 pm

I'm pumped for St. Louis FC as well. I know AC St. Louis bit it hard a few years back, but ownership seems to be a tad more stable this time around with realistic goals. What needs to happen is fan support. I think St. Louis skates by on 'we were the premier soccer town in the country!' far too often. People need to show up and support the team once they get it.
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