Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Discuss the St. Louis Blues, the NHL, or anything hockey. (Formerly the Blues News Forum)

Moderator: LGB Mods

glen a richter
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 11410
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by glen a richter »

theohall wrote:
glen a richter wrote:... that they'd resort to mass transit and a lot of people don't know how mass transit works unless they're going directly to Penn Station.
Not understanding mass transit in NYC????? How stupid are these people??? Everything related to mass transit is color-coded. I have been there once - never having been there before - and guided around a family of 15 people simply following the color codes.

AFAIK, most hockey fans are technically savvy which means understanding simple color codes should be easy.

Making the trip??? An entirely different proposition.
You'd be surprised how many people know "Get on the train in your town, take it to Penn Station, get off the train." and that's it. We do have a website called hopstop that can eliminate a lot of the confusion. Anyway, to get somewhat back on topic: it would probably be for the better if the Islanders stayed in the metro area because we all know how Wang operates with regard to long term contracts (Rick DiPietro) and what goes best with a long distance relocation but making a big free agent splash to help win over the new fanbase? The team couldn't afford it. Hopefully the new CBA eliminates nonsense like DiPietro's contract, and Weber's offer sheet. But let's face it, the owners employ the GM, the GM dishes out the insane contracts, then the owners are the ones who want to radically change the CBA to eliminate the damage done by these huge contracts. If I was a pro athlete and someone threw this kind of change at me, I'd jump all over it like Oprah on a baked ham. It's not the players faults the GM's are fools. The owners need to reign in their management teams, that's the bottom line.
Sponsor of Joel "Future" HOFer 2023-2024

User avatar
theohall
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 9213
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 9:49 pm
Location: Jacksonville, FL

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by theohall »

glen a richter wrote:You'd be surprised how many people know "Get on the train in your town, take it to Penn Station, get off the train." and that's it. We do have a website called hopstop that can eliminate a lot of the confusion. Anyway, to get somewhat back on topic: it would probably be for the better if the Islanders stayed in the metro area because we all know how Wang operates with regard to long term contracts (Rick DiPietro) and what goes best with a long distance relocation but making a big free agent splash to help win over the new fanbase? The team couldn't afford it. Hopefully the new CBA eliminates nonsense like DiPietro's contract, and Weber's offer sheet. But let's face it, the owners employ the GM, the GM dishes out the insane contracts, then the owners are the ones who want to radically change the CBA to eliminate the damage done by these huge contracts. If I was a pro athlete and someone threw this kind of change at me, I'd jump all over it like Oprah on a baked ham. It's not the players faults the GM's are fools. The owners need to reign in their management teams, that's the bottom line.
AFAIK, GMs have to have Owner's approval to offer some ridiculous contract, which puts it back on the Owners, period.
Official LGB sponsor of Robert Thomas 2022-2023 Season

glen a richter
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 11410
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by glen a richter »

theohall wrote:
glen a richter wrote:You'd be surprised how many people know "Get on the train in your town, take it to Penn Station, get off the train." and that's it. We do have a website called hopstop that can eliminate a lot of the confusion. Anyway, to get somewhat back on topic: it would probably be for the better if the Islanders stayed in the metro area because we all know how Wang operates with regard to long term contracts (Rick DiPietro) and what goes best with a long distance relocation but making a big free agent splash to help win over the new fanbase? The team couldn't afford it. Hopefully the new CBA eliminates nonsense like DiPietro's contract, and Weber's offer sheet. But let's face it, the owners employ the GM, the GM dishes out the insane contracts, then the owners are the ones who want to radically change the CBA to eliminate the damage done by these huge contracts. If I was a pro athlete and someone threw this kind of change at me, I'd jump all over it like Oprah on a baked ham. It's not the players faults the GM's are fools. The owners need to reign in their management teams, that's the bottom line.
AFAIK, GMs have to have Owner's approval to offer some ridiculous contract, which puts it back on the Owners, period.
Then they shouldn't be bitching now and putting next season in jeopardy. Do they care or don't they care? Fight it out amongst yourselves without risking the loss of all or part of yet another season. Hockey has become the model for labor dysfunction while baseball is the model of labor perfection, and that's just ass backwards.

Here's a radical idea: You sign a player to a contract that is clearly designed to circumvent the cap, you forfeit your first round picks for the duration of that contract to whichever team finishes in last place each of those seasons, or you sign a player to that kind of contract, you pay a higher percentage in the revenue sharing. Don't cost us a (Franking) season of (Franking) hockey because you jackasses couldn't control your checkbooks.
Sponsor of Joel "Future" HOFer 2023-2024

User avatar
WaukeeBlues
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 6163
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 3:00 pm
Location: Phi Alpha

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by WaukeeBlues »

glen a richter wrote:...
Here's a radical idea: You sign a player to a contract that is clearly designed to circumvent the cap, you forfeit your first round picks for the duration of that contract to whichever team finishes in last place each of those seasons, or you sign a player to that kind of contract, you pay a higher percentage in the revenue sharing. Don't cost us a (Frank) season of (Frank) hockey because you jackasses couldn't control your checkbooks.
THAT'S the problem. What does "clearly circumvent the cap" mean? We only have one line to look at and that's Kovalchuk's. Everything less than that is okay? I don't think so. There has to be concrete rules that can't be "interpreted."

Copy & Paste: "I'm not necessarily opposed to the longer term deals per se. What I don't like is what New Jersey got slapped for and that's the "purposeful avoidance of the salary cap." They need to close that loophole with re-drafting the rules to actually provide some clear guidance to GM's as to what's okay and what's not. My thought would be a rule stating that you can sign a player for any number of years that you want, but a certain % differential is not allowed. (E.g. You want to sign Kovy to a 14 year deal? Go right ahead. But you can't have more than a 50% difference in his salary year to year. Something like that. You could play with the specific %). It would discourage long-term deals without forbidding them and also reign in the salary cap circumvention concerns. Boom."

So to put a specific example on it: Weber's deal: (from TSN) "In total, Weber will make $14 million in each of the first four years; $12 million in years five and six; $6 million in each of the next four seasons; $3 million in year 11; and $1 million in each of the remaining years."

With my suggestion, if the Flyers wanted to pay Weber $14 million his first year, they'd be forbidden from paying him less than $7 million for the length of the contract. That would lob off EIGHT years of his contract and bump his cap hit up to a staggering $13.3 million per season.


In other words: the offer wouldn't have been made. Or at least not as long or with as great a differential amount in salary, which I think may violate the Kovalchuk rule anyway.

This would allow, e.g. a 10 year, $100 million contract, $10 million per. I see nothing wrong with THAT kind of contract, just the ones like Weber's. This is why I don't think there should be a year limit or "amount" limit, because if you want to keep a good player around for a very long time you should be able to: just not be able to play the system in the process.
Official 2021-2022 LGB Sponsor of Torey Krug
Official 2021 LGB Sponsor of Brayden Schenn
Official 2018-2019 LGB Sponsor of Jaden Schwartz
2018 LGB Playoff Challenge Champ
Official 2017-2018 LGB Sponsor of Vladimir Tarasenko
Official 2016-2017 LGB Sponsor of Scottie Upshall
Official 2015-2016 LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk

User avatar
Winning Unlimited
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame
Posts: 3821
Joined: Wed Jul 05, 2006 1:06 pm
Location: Chesterfield

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by Winning Unlimited »

I always thought that the maximum salary for a season should be the number that counts against the cap for the length of the contract.
Image

kodos
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 11892
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 7:05 pm

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by kodos »

Nashville to match.
Image

User avatar
philco_3
All-Star
All-Star
Posts: 2297
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 7:43 pm
Location: Red Bud, IL and Section 307 Row M

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by philco_3 »

kodos wrote:Nashville to match.
Beat me to it.
2009-2010 LGB Official Sponsor of Roman Polak
2010-2011 LGB Official Sponsor of the Brad Boyes 2011 2nd round draft pick.
2011-2012 LGB Official Sponsor of "The Russian" Evgeny Grachev
Image
2013 LGB Official Sponsor of David Perron
2013-2014 LGB Official Sponsor of Jay Bouwmeester

9-7-11 We Will Never Forget.

User avatar
STLADOGG
All-Star
All-Star
Posts: 2492
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 8:41 pm
Location: -Saint Freaking Louis-

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by STLADOGG »

kodos wrote:Nashville to match.
How? Is Nashville really a better market than St. Louis?
Image
Official Stalker of Paul "Speedy Gonzalez" Kariya
2014-2015 Official LGB Sponsor of Vladimir Tarasenko
TW Tiger Woods TW

glen a richter
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 11410
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 8:02 am
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by glen a richter »

Well that upsets the evening out of things in the east. Oh well.
Sponsor of Joel "Future" HOFer 2023-2024

User avatar
philco_3
All-Star
All-Star
Posts: 2297
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 7:43 pm
Location: Red Bud, IL and Section 307 Row M

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by philco_3 »

Well as I see it as long as Detroit didn't get any major player signage this off season makes this me happy. But I also hate seeing Nashville with any sort of star power.
2009-2010 LGB Official Sponsor of Roman Polak
2010-2011 LGB Official Sponsor of the Brad Boyes 2011 2nd round draft pick.
2011-2012 LGB Official Sponsor of "The Russian" Evgeny Grachev
Image
2013 LGB Official Sponsor of David Perron
2013-2014 LGB Official Sponsor of Jay Bouwmeester

9-7-11 We Will Never Forget.

User avatar
WaukeeBlues
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 6163
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 3:00 pm
Location: Phi Alpha

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by WaukeeBlues »

Very surprised. Thought for sure they'd take the 4 picks.
Official 2021-2022 LGB Sponsor of Torey Krug
Official 2021 LGB Sponsor of Brayden Schenn
Official 2018-2019 LGB Sponsor of Jaden Schwartz
2018 LGB Playoff Challenge Champ
Official 2017-2018 LGB Sponsor of Vladimir Tarasenko
Official 2016-2017 LGB Sponsor of Scottie Upshall
Official 2015-2016 LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk

User avatar
philco_3
All-Star
All-Star
Posts: 2297
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 7:43 pm
Location: Red Bud, IL and Section 307 Row M

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by philco_3 »

A funny thing happened today, while I was at work someone came in wearing a Blue Jackets shirt. Me and a co worker asked him if he was fan and what he thought of the trade. Sure enough in Southern Illinois there is a Blue Jackets fan, and he pretty much said Columbus still got screwed. They could have gotten more picks out of this.
2009-2010 LGB Official Sponsor of Roman Polak
2010-2011 LGB Official Sponsor of the Brad Boyes 2011 2nd round draft pick.
2011-2012 LGB Official Sponsor of "The Russian" Evgeny Grachev
Image
2013 LGB Official Sponsor of David Perron
2013-2014 LGB Official Sponsor of Jay Bouwmeester

9-7-11 We Will Never Forget.

User avatar
gaijin
Hall Of Fame
Hall Of Fame
Posts: 4820
Joined: Mon Feb 24, 2003 7:46 pm
Location: Peterson AFB, CO

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by gaijin »

One thing I don't understand about RFAs- if their team matches the offer the other team makes, is the RFA forced to re-sign with their current team? Or do they still have the option to choose to sign the deal with the new team?
Image

User avatar
theohall
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 9213
Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2003 9:49 pm
Location: Jacksonville, FL

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by theohall »

gaijin wrote:One thing I don't understand about RFAs- if their team matches the offer the other team makes, is the RFA forced to re-sign with their current team? Or do they still have the option to choose to sign the deal with the new team?
Forced to sign with current team. This is why they are "restricted."
Official LGB sponsor of Robert Thomas 2022-2023 Season

User avatar
WaukeeBlues
Hockey God
Hockey God
Posts: 6163
Joined: Sun Apr 08, 2007 3:00 pm
Location: Phi Alpha

Re: Shea Weber to PHI for what???

Post by WaukeeBlues »

theohall wrote:
gaijin wrote:One thing I don't understand about RFAs- if their team matches the offer the other team makes, is the RFA forced to re-sign with their current team? Or do they still have the option to choose to sign the deal with the new team?
Forced to sign with current team. This is why they are "restricted."
Which is why I found it kind of funny that throughout this whole episode you could tell through Weber's quotes how excited he was to be heading to Philly but he would always caveat it with something rosy like "but then again I've been in Nashville my whole career and would enjoy remaining a Predator" :lol:
Official 2021-2022 LGB Sponsor of Torey Krug
Official 2021 LGB Sponsor of Brayden Schenn
Official 2018-2019 LGB Sponsor of Jaden Schwartz
2018 LGB Playoff Challenge Champ
Official 2017-2018 LGB Sponsor of Vladimir Tarasenko
Official 2016-2017 LGB Sponsor of Scottie Upshall
Official 2015-2016 LGB Sponsor of Kevin Shattenkirk

Post Reply