#YeoMustGo

[Toasted Oates]

He did pretty well in Minnesota, considering how gutless and soft that group of players is. They can't win, regardless of who the coach is.

He's done pretty well in St. Louis, considering he hasn't had the services of a proven top 6 NHL winger in Robby Fabbri. Yeah, it's one guy, but you lose him and bottom 6 players move up. Someone else gets hurt, another moves up. You get the picture.

Sure, Mike Yeo is nothing spectacular. But if you're making a list of "Why the Blues Suck," he's not even in the top 5 IMO.

[gaijin]

Sure, Mike Yeo is nothing spectacular. But if you're making a list of "Why the Blues Suck," he's not even in the top 5 IMO.

I'd be interested to see your top 5.

I haven't really sat down and though about a list, but a lot of the reasons I could think of could probably have been mitigated (or at least lessened) by coaching decisions- style of play, special teams strategies, addressing lapses in effort, etc.

As a military officer, if the troops under my supervision are underperforming, it's on me to figure out ways to right the ship. Is it a perfect analogy? No, of course. But I think it's close enough.

[theohall]

He did pretty well in Minnesota, considering how gutless and soft that group of players is. They can't win, regardless of who the coach is.

He's done pretty well in St. Louis, considering he hasn't had the services of a proven top 6 NHL winger in Robby Fabbri. Yeah, it's one guy, but you lose him and bottom 6 players move up. Someone else gets hurt, another moves up. You get the picture.

Sure, Mike Yeo is nothing spectacular. But if you're making a list of "Why the Blues Suck," he's not even in the top 5 IMO.

Well, the Wild roster barely changed from 15-16 to 16-17, yet they went from 87 points under Yeo/Torchetti to 107 points under Boudreau. Only significant change was the head coach. Why is Boudreau getting more from players than Yeo was able to? What did Boudreau do to add 20 points to a team's record in 16-17 with very little roster movement.

2nd worst power play in the league is not "done pretty well" with St Louis. And it's getting worse while Yeo is doing absolutely nothing about it.

Last game - 21st game together before the 91 injury of 17/10/91/20 - that unit failed to score again. Prior to the non-Tarasenko PP unit scoring, they were 2 for 32 since in past 10 games... yet they were still together. What kind of coach leaves together a unit which flat out is not producing? Then add in the joke that is the 2nd power play unit - a checking line. (No, I am not saying Tarasenko is the problem. Just split up the dang talent over 2 units to actually use the power play more effectively, instead of making it so dang easy to defend).

I know the theory of using a 4th forward on the power play is because they are generally better at making offensive plays. Well, the Blues have 4 defenseman all capable of making those same kind of quality offensive plays, so the need to put a 4th forward there is irrelevant. Unfortunately, the idiot coach hasn't figured this out, yet. It's stunningly simple to try. The question is why the coach won't even bother to try, but continue to do more of the same which continues not to work. Heck, the PP goal last night - Dunn and Pietrangelo were both on the ice with Dunn getting the primary assist from the left point. But - you know - Yeo will stick with 1 D and 4 forwards for the next game which hasn't worked and has led to, again, the 2nd worst power play in the league. That's entirely on the coach for not changing it. And without an above average power play, NHL teams do not make the playoffs. Yes, there are outliers, but those are few and far between.

[theohall]

As a military officer, if the troops under my supervision are underperforming, it's on me to figure out ways to right the ship. Is it a perfect analogy? No, of course. But I think it's close enough.

Speaking from personal experience, if the ship isn't righted within a reasonable time frame, or it appears the ship isn't being righted, the officer gets replaced.

One ship I served on went through three Captains in less than 2 years - there usual rotation is 3 years. The 4th guy had the issues fixed in 2 months.

The Blues current officer doesn't appear to even try to be fixing clear deficiencies.

[Toasted Oates]

First off, much respect to the both of you for serving.

Second, what they've done in the regular season under Boudreau matters not to me. Still got bounced pretty easily in the games that matter. I'll agree that the more open play would give them more energy during the season ---> more points.

As far as a top 5 list, I haven't thought about it either. I pulled that number out of my ass to be honest. There probably aren't even 5 reasons because a lot of the issues fall under the same umbrella IMO: roster construction/cap management. I feel those issues are more pressing.

The off-season will be a good barometer to see if any mistakes will be admitted; philosophies changed. If that includes firing the coach, so be it, but it better not come close to ending there. And I hope it's not a lateral move because that's what I fear.

Think outside the box if you're gonna do it. Theo and I agree there.

[theohall]

Updates on this list. I still want the Blues to hire Benoit Groulx and bring the Tampa system to the Blues.

Benoit Groulx - Syracuse Crunch. Outstanding at developing young talent. Available. Still with Syracuse

Sheldon Keefe - Toronto Marlies. Had done so well developing talent for the Leafs, they wound up having too many guys under contract and were forced to trade some of it. That's how Blues wound up with Soshnikov, although he's not one of the better examples. Available. Still with Marlies


Dave Lowry - LA Kings. We've covered this here. Available. Still with Kings as an assistant. Were his title Associate Head Coach, the Blues couldn't talk to him.


Jim Montgomery - Denver University. Steady improvement every season in Denver culminating in a National Championship last season. Hired by Dallas Stars who have doubled their goals for in the first four games of the season compared to last season.


Kirk Muller - MTL Canadiens (he gets how to make a power play work and makes in-game adjustments, sometimes on the same power play). We are already familiar with where the Blues went with him as an associate coach in the 15-16 season and the power play was a huge part of the reason for them getting that far. Unavailable without Canadiens permission due to title of associate coach.


Todd Nelson - Grand Rapids Griffins. Won Calder Cup. This is the guy I can find the least information about. While he had an interim job as Oilers head coach before Todd McLellan took over, he has been involved with winning championships in the UHL and AHL both as a head coach and an associate coach. Available. Currently an assistant coach for the Stars. Hmm... Dallas hired two guys from this list.

Mike Van Ryn - Tucson Roadrunners. Need to give more detail on this one. This is the only outlier due to only 2 full seasons as head coach, but, worked his way up from associate to head coach over 10 years. First head coaching gig was with the Kitchener Rangers where his team went 13-0-3 before losing his first regulation game as a head coach. They ended up getting swept by a loaded London Knights team in the 2nd round of the playoffs after finishing 4th in the conference. His current team is 2nd overall in the AHL. He gets the most out of his players, it seems, when he is leading the team. Blues assistant coach, but it looks like he isn't the answer, since he is the assistant in charge of the Blues current defensive corps which isn't getting it done. Or it's Yeo's system Van Ryn is being forced to coach and a different voice might free him. No idea.

[glen a richter]

Yes we're only 5 games in, but two questions:

1. How bad does it get before Yeo gets fired? The Blues have either been blown out or had to claw back before blowing it in each of the losses. This team shows no resilience, never has over the foreseeable past. If they don't get out to a decent lead early on, they can't fight back, and heaven forbid they get into a hole, they seem to give up. When I see they're down 1-0 I know there's a strong chance they'll lose. There's been no indication that Yeo is going to ever change his coaching strategy which is dull, outdated and predictable and also why it's easy for the teams that are even semi-decent to plan for and beat the Blues at their own game. I had hoped the addition of Blais, Thomas and Kyrou would impact the way Yeo handles the lines in all aspects of the game, but it clearly hasn't so far, and in fact has turned out to be what I was afraid of--a rigid coach spoiling the development of the talented youngsters.

2. Since the team is obviously looking at what appears to be a soft rebuild with three kid forwards and a few new names on the roster, do you support the next step of trading Pietrangelo if things stay this way through the quarterpost? As much blame goes on the coach, at least some also needs to go on the captain who obviously isn't much of a locker room leader on a team with the aforementioned zero resilience. You can probably get a sizable haul for Pie in terms of picks and prospects to continue the rebuild that's obviously underway.

[gaijin]

Yes we're only 5 games in, but two questions:

1. How bad does it get before Yeo gets fired? The Blues have either been blown out or had to claw back before blowing it in each of the losses. This team shows no resilience, never has over the foreseeable past. If they don't get out to a decent lead early on, they can't fight back, and heaven forbid they get into a hole, they seem to give up. When I see they're down 1-0 I know there's a strong chance they'll lose. There's been no indication that Yeo is going to ever change his coaching strategy which is dull, outdated and predictable and also why it's easy for the teams that are even semi-decent to plan for and beat the Blues at their own game. I had hoped the addition of Blais, Thomas and Kyrou would impact the way Yeo handles the lines in all aspects of the game, but it clearly hasn't so far, and in fact has turned out to be what I was afraid of--a rigid coach spoiling the development of the talented youngsters.

2. Since the team is obviously looking at what appears to be a soft rebuild with three kid forwards and a few new names on the roster, do you support the next step of trading Pietrangelo if things stay this way through the quarterpost? As much blame goes on the coach, at least some also needs to go on the captain who obviously isn't much of a locker room leader on a team with the aforementioned zero resilience. You can probably get a sizable haul for Pie in terms of picks and prospects to continue the rebuild that's obviously underway.

1. The sooner the better in my opinion. When Yeo was hired on as head-coach-in-waiting, I was one of those in the "I don't like where this is going" camp. When Hitch was about to be canned, I said they either needed to fire both Hitch and Yeo (or keep them both), because firing Hitch and making Yeo head coach was no change at all. But as long as the wins kept coming (a la spring 2017), I was fine with it. Well, beyond those initial couple of months, the wins got more infrequent, resulting in missing the playoffs for the first time in 7 seasons. So far this year, it seems to be worse. GRANTED, we're only 5 games into an 82-game season, but we are on pace for a grand total of 66 points. That with a greatly improved (at least on paper) roster compared to last year.

2. Honesty, I don't know if I agree that the team is obviously in a rebuild. They didn't get rid of any top-tier talent in exchange for picks or youngsters. Yes, they traded Stastny (not that he was performing at a top-tier level) at the deadline last season, which signaled they might be in rebuild mode, but then they didn't make any more moves. In the offseason they jettisoned some dead weight (Berglund, Sobotka), but nothing else I would consider a rebuilding move. I'd say if anything, based on the offseason acquisitions they made (ROR, Bozak, Perron), they have built a roster for now rather than stockpiling draft picks and prospects in the hopes of a better team 2-4 years from now.

Now, that is a long way to say I don't know if they should trade Pietrangelo or not. I guess it would depend on what the return is. I can't imagine our D-corps would collapse without him (or be significantly worse than they are currently), but on the other hand, competitive teams seem to have at least 2 dominant defensemen, and if we trade Petro, who becomes #2 after Parayko? Edmundson? Bouwmeester? I don't know if Dunn is a #2 yet. So I'll take the middle path I guess- I don't advocate for it, but I also won't lose much sleep if it happens (and they get a good return).

[goon attack]

I say he gets 15 games max.

[theohall]

Need to change the head coach before dumping Petro. Pietrangelo's play has regressed since when? Since Mike Yeo too over as head coach. Coincidence? Or is Petro dealing with the distractions of being a father and not as focused on the ice. I have no idea, but would rather dump the coach and his system, first, before trading a player who has the potential to win a Norris trophy when he's playing at his best.

[ComradeT]

http://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/2500 ... eing-fired

I don't know if I buy the whole coach/save% adage and ESPN is really stating the obvious but nonetheless Yeo is not being recognized as under fire in the national press. He's in a pretty good company... Including the current Wild coach Boudreau.

Yeo is in the third year of a four-year deal that started with him as an associate coach under Ken Hitchcock. To say the bar's been raised for the Blues this season would be underselling it, after they were one of the most active teams in the summer. They missed the playoffs last season and are stumbling early in a very tough division. It's said that a coach is only as good as his goalie, and Jake Allen has a .878 save percentage. Eek.

[theohall]

ESPN's has the absolute worst hockey coverage of any of the current National sports reporting groups.

The Athletic, TSN, SportsNet, and NHLRadio have all talked about the Blues issues and none of them are blaming the goaltending, due to the ludicrous number of high danger scoring chances the Blues are surrendering as a result of their defensive scheme. After the first two games, the Sportsnet dudes mentioned the goaltending. After game 5, they shifted the blame to the Blues defensive play. Blues are 6th in High Danger Chances Allowed based on a per 60 minutes basis and have surrendered the most goals of any team in the NHL from those high danger areas, in spite of having played 1 fewer game than all but 5 other teams. This was also an issue for the Wild under Yeo. Yet another similarity.

And no one has Yeo on the hot seat, which I can't figure out at all if anyone takes the time to compare what has happened with the Blues over the past 3 years and what happened with the Wild under Yeo. Too many similarities.

[Robb_K]

Need to change the head coach before dumping Petro. Pietrangelo's play has regressed since when? Since Mike Yeo too over as head coach. Coincidence? Or is Petro dealing with the distractions of being a father and not as focused on the ice. I have no idea, but would rather dump the coach and his system, first, before trading a player who has the potential to win a Norris trophy when he's playing at his best.

I remember midnight bottle feedings and getting very little sleep during the first six months with one kid at a time. Having 3 newborn infants would mean being constantly tired and occupied with things to do that would cut into being able to concentrate on work issues.
I wouldn't write Pietrangelo off, and devalue him, trying to dump him off. The combination of being distracted by issues and factors from home, combined with the bad results of Yeo's ineffective system, has hurt his play. If Berube, or another coach can get The Blues playing reasonably well, Pietrangelo should be able to be a lot more effective.

Yeo has proven, all through his coaching career, to not adjust his system and coaching style to address problems. He clearly had lost The Blues' players, even before this season started. The Blues need to get rid of him immediately, to salvage this season.

[theohall]

While I want Yeo gone 3 years ago...

There is going to be one massive problem. This is the Blues only slow schedule month this year. If they fire Yeo, how will the Blues be able to get enough work in to actually fix the broken system they've been playing for 2+ years? The shift from Hitchcock to Yeo wasn't that big. It was basically changing d-zone coverage. The issues now are transition - which is part of what preseason is used for - to work out the quirks in whatever transition game the team is using plus fixing the d-zone coverage.

According to the Lightning Reporter for The Athletic and stuff Brian Engblom says during their games, Tampa still spends the majority of their practices working on their transition game unless something arose during a game or two that the coach thinks they need to work on. It shows in how smoothly they switch and wind up having layers in case the 1st guy to handle the puck has an issue.

Fixing the Blues issues, IMO, means fixing both the lame transition game plan (which didn't take any effort for the coach to "install" - hey, you guys fly beyond center and the defense will get it to you) plus reworking how to protect their own end and get the defenseman to quit making boneheaded plays - all of them. It's not just one one of them. Basically every Blues defenseman, except Butler (hard to believe I typed that), has made a boneheaded play in a game this season that led to a goal against. 6 games in and 8 or 9 different defenseman have done this. That's staggering.