Free Agent Moves and Major Trades

[glen a richter]

Hall for Larsson seems a lot like they want Shatty too, and expect to get him. Otherwise they got franked. I wouldn't be surprised if they also moved RNH for Shatty later in the offseason. Adding two veteran dmen instantly makes Edmonton better. Adding Larsson makes it more appealing for Shatty to negotiate an extension pre-trade.

[theohall]

They aren't Blues moves but Taylor Hall to NJ for Adam Larsson and then PK Subban to Nash for Shea Weber.

What an afternoon. So the rumor is that Edmonton didn't want to pull the trigger on a Taylor Hall for Shatty deal, but they trade him for Adam Larsson? Hmmm.

So the coach won in Montreal with Subban being traded. Surprised Nashville took on more salary for the same term for, IMO, a lesser player than Weber. Not sure how well Subban's ego will play out in Nashville. Big upgrade for the Canadiens defense.

Larsson for Hall over Shatty?? WTF??? Just because Armstrong asked for him? I guess NJ can actually claim they have one talented player now. Oh... Larsson is under contract through the 20-21 season with a 4.167M cap hit compared to having to pay Shattenkirk after this season. (nhlnumbers.com for source of numbers) This is the kind of thing Chiarelli did before over-paying players in Boston.

[glen a richter]

I get that Larsson is only 23, but he's still a veteran of all or part of 5 seasons. He's got a solid upside and if that doesn't entice Shatty to agree to a contract extension, I don't know what will. Edmonton isn't done. We all know they have a plethora of young scorers they won't be able to afford and they desperately needed a blueline makeover. Getting Larsson isn't the last move they'll make.

[theohall]

Hall for Larsson seems a lot like they want Shatty too, and expect to get him. Otherwise they got franked. I wouldn't be surprised if they also moved RNH for Shatty later in the offseason. Adding two veteran dmen instantly makes Edmonton better. Adding Larsson makes it more appealing for Shatty to negotiate an extension pre-trade.

Thing is Armstrong already didn't want a RNH for Shatty trade straight up or it likely would have already been done. He wanted the LW Taylor Hall. Not sure Army will hit that well again for the guy he didn't want given the number of centers already on the Blues roster. Although, RNH is also a left-handed shot, so who knows??

[theohall]

I get that Larsson is only 23, but he's still a veteran of all or part of 5 seasons. He's got a solid upside and if that doesn't entice Shatty to agree to a contract extension, I don't know what will. Edmonton isn't done. We all know they have a plethora of young scorers they won't be able to afford and they desperately needed a blueline makeover. Getting Larsson isn't the last move they'll make.

They have 9M in cap space right now and it gets easier over the next few years, even with their current roster. Yakupov likely be gone when is RFA year hits leaving the RFA Draisaitl to re-sign in 2017. They've got two years to figure this out now that they moved one of the two guys under a 6M cap long term contract.

McDavid, Eberle, and Pouliot - that's it for the 3 "big" forwards they have to worry about over the next 3 years. I'm not buying the "they can't pay them thing" anymore looking at Edmonton's actual cap numbers. And that would include adding a high end defenseman FA without trading anyone else.

[gaijin]

Great. We get to see Subban more often.

Dude kills us. Oh well, it's not like Weber took it easy on us either.

[glen a richter]

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/blues-sign ... --nhl.html

[theohall]

You know which team looks worse than Edmonton moving forward the next couple of years in terms of signing "core" players. The St Louis frickin' Blues. Too many UFAs. Too many key top-line contributors.

This is the reason they drafted all those centers.

Stastny - not worth what he's getting already and will be a UFA in 2018. (7M current hit) - but will need to be replaced.
Steen - UFA in 2017 (6.5M curren hit). Will be older, so what be a "long term" deal, but it depends on how he's still playing what the contract will demand.
Schwartz - RFA now - 4-6 cap hit.
Backes - UFA now. Simiilar replacement will be 4-6 cap hit.
Parayko - RFA 2017 and will likely get a Seth Jones type deal if he improves even a little from this past season. I would be surprised if the Blues sign him for less.

I don't give a darn about Brouwer and Paajarvi at this point.

Yes, the Blues can afford those players and replacing those who leave, but unless they go with mediocre players or guys on entry level contracts, they will be against the cap with no room for movement like they've been the past two seasons.

Edmonton will have more flexibility unless they make ridiculous offers to the 3 "top forwards" to be signed (over the next 3 seasons, so it's spread out) combined with whatever they do on defense. The Blues don't have the luxury of spreading out over 3 years either keeping or replacing 4 of the 6 players on their top 2 lines. They have to start this year and figure out the rest next season. And this isn't even considering what will happen with the 3rd line.

As much as some of us don't like it, the 4th line, minus Ott, is already under contract - Upshall/Brodziak/Reaves.

The fact Shattenkirk is being shopped with Army asking for a top line forward indicates to me the Blues expect to lose Backes to free agency. Say the Blues did get RNH for Shattenkirk. That's 6M per year for RNH for the next 5 years. This would have made the Blues cap space drop from 15.361 to 14.561 because RNH has an .8M per year higher cap hit than Shatty. With that much room, the Blues could re-sign both Backes and Schwartz. It would then be a matter of figuring out how to handle Steen and Stastny next year, but the problem, were things to play out this way - is paying Parayko - unless Bouwmeester is taken in the expansion draft. It's just not as clear cut in terms of maintaining the forwards while keeping Parayko compared to what Edmonton could easily do given the guys already under contract.

[Oaklandblue]

I forsee Shatt being shipped off for picks and Army stacking picks for a possible rebuild. I actually see our window starting to close as I sit here.

[dmiles2186]

I forsee Shatt being shipped off for picks and Army stacking picks for a possible rebuild. I actually see our window starting to close as I sit here.

I don't at all. Tarasenko and Schwartz are what? 24? Fabbri is 20 (Franking) years old. Parayko is 22 or 23. Edmundson around the same age. Jake Allen is 26. Pieterangelo is 26. That's a whole host of talent and I'm sure I'm leaving some out.

[WaukeeBlues]

NHL Network radio was saying yesterday that their belief was that Chiarelli wanted some kind of a "guarantee" that Shattenkirk would sign a long term deal once a trade was completed and Armstrong obviously couldn't give that reassurance and wouldn't let the Oilers talk with Shattenkirk ahead of time, for reasons obvious. So Chiarelli had to look elsewhere, for a young defenseman that already had a long term deal in place. Hence, Larsson.

More and more I'm thinking Shattenkirk is better to move at next year's trade deadline than it is to move him this offseason. Nobody is going to probably give us equal value for him right now, much less overpay, as teams are all too willing to do at the deadline.

If the Blues don't get offered a fair deal for him, f*ck it, hang on to him and look again at the deadline what our options are.

Devils just fleeced the Oilers there. But Chiarelli is under a LOT of pressure to get a defenseman in there. But, he had to drastically overpay to do so. I was surprised it was Hall. I thought he'd be one of the last to be traded considering the Oilers are stacked down the middle. Maybe he's counting on Lucic signing there. The Oilers aren't done, not by a long shot.

Subban for Weber: Lots of Canadiens fans are surprisingly upset about this. Shocker of a blockbuster trade, that's for sure. Contract wise Weber could royally f*ck the Predators down the road if he retires early and the cap recapture just destroys Nashville but that's a good 8+ years down the road. I think the Canadiens got the better of the deal quite honestly. I don't quite get Nashville's decision. Only thing I can figure is after they lost to the Sharks they wanted to get leaner and faster, of which Subban is undoubtedly moreso than Weber. Also a gut wrenching trade: I can't imagine being a die-hard Preds fan with Weber being your guy (and vice versa with the Canadiens and Subban) and being dealt. Definitely don't see this happen that often, that's for darn sure.

[glen a richter]

I'll tell you what the best option is in terms of moving Shatty, if he has to move. The Rangers. He grew up a Rangers fan, he'd sign long term with them in a heartbeat, they'd pay him, and they have a number of intriguing players in system that I wouldn't object to getting in a trade. Wingers Niklas Jensen and Pavel Buchnevich jump out from the guys who are in the pipeline, and off their NHL roster Zuccarello and Kreider.

[Kerfuffle]

Does anyone understand the Subban for Weber trade? Both are top defenders, highly paid. I don't get the trade-off - each team gets a great player but loses one in the process so what's the gain? Unless this was a trade just for scenery changes for both players.

[dmiles2186]

Does anyone understand the Subban for Weber trade? Both are top defenders, highly paid. I don't get the trade-off - each team gets a great player but loses one in the process so what's the gain? Unless this was a trade just for scenery changes for both players.

Apparently you can't be charitable on your own accord:
https://twitter.com/Rick_City/status/748365586237882372

[cardsfan04]

Does anyone understand the Subban for Weber trade? Both are top defenders, highly paid. I don't get the trade-off - each team gets a great player but loses one in the process so what's the gain? Unless this was a trade just for scenery changes for both players.

Apparently you can't be charitable on your own accord:
https://twitter.com/Rick_City/status/748365586237882372

eek, if the Habs wanted to move Subban because he donated $7 million (or whatever it was) to a children's hospital, that's rather peculiar. There has to be more to the story than that, right?

[dmiles2186]

Does anyone understand the Subban for Weber trade? Both are top defenders, highly paid. I don't get the trade-off - each team gets a great player but loses one in the process so what's the gain? Unless this was a trade just for scenery changes for both players.

Apparently you can't be charitable on your own accord:
https://twitter.com/Rick_City/status/748365586237882372

eek, if the Habs wanted to move Subban because he donated $7 million (or whatever it was) to a children's hospital, that's rather peculiar. There has to be more to the story than that, right?

I'm assuming. I've seen people throw 'character issues' around, which is strange for a guy that hasn't been in trouble off the ice, by all accounts does several charitable things in the area, and is a fan favorite. It's all very weird. Pat Kane has character issues. PK Subban is a saint compared to Pat Kane.

That said, we don't know what it's like in the locker room. Maybe Montreal wanted more of a leader? I don't know....it just all seems really shady.

[WaukeeBlues]

Does anyone understand the Subban for Weber trade? Both are top defenders, highly paid. I don't get the trade-off - each team gets a great player but loses one in the process so what's the gain? Unless this was a trade just for scenery changes for both players.

My own personal opinion is that the Predators were looking to get leaner and faster after being beat by the Sharks and seeing the Penguins win the cup with speed; and the Canadiens, for years, have been trying to play more heavy and add some size. They just got Shaw for some grit and added Weber for even more.

That's about the best I got.

Ancillary reasons/speculation out there says that P.K. was a divisive personality in the locker room and coach didn't like him so bring in Weber, the leadership award winner to rally the troops, that the Preds were re-thinking their matching of the Flyers offer sheet on Weber and wanted to move the massive contract at some point and this provided an opporunity... I don't know that we'll ever know.

I think I can safely assume, though, that P.K. Subban donating millions of dollars to a Montreal children's hospital was NOT the reason. If that kind of a move "burns bridges" then you're just an insane a**hole.

This trade had to rip some fan's hearts out. As a GM you don't make this deal without swallowing really hard first. Takes some guts to make this drastic of a move. I don't fully understand it myself really.

[theohall]

The divide in the Montreal locker room was often discussed on NHL Radio during the season. Subban thought he should be Captain, because they paid him like one. Pacioretty didn't agree. Tension resulted. Then there was the stuff between the coach and Subban when the team was struggling. Meanwhile, Weber won the Mark Messier leadership award for the 2015-16 season. He is the kind of leader Montreal needs. I truly don't understand why Nashville made the deal, but whole heartedly get why Montreal did it - and it's not about off-ice charity stuff. It's locker room stuff with the Captain and coach not seeing eye to eye with the highest paid player on the team - or so one would believe based on the NHL Radio chatter and some things Don Cherry brought up a couple of times on HNIC.

[Kerfuffle]

Ancillary reasons/speculation out there says that P.K. was a divisive personality in the locker room and coach didn't like him so bring in Weber, the leadership award winner to rally the troops, that the Preds were re-thinking their matching of the Flyers offer sheet on Weber and wanted to move the massive contract at some point and this provided an opportunity.

Good points above you made here - I think these are both logical reasons for both guys switching teams. thx!

[theohall]

Ancillary reasons/speculation out there says that P.K. was a divisive personality in the locker room and coach didn't like him so bring in Weber, the leadership award winner to rally the troops, that the Preds were re-thinking their matching of the Flyers offer sheet on Weber and wanted to move the massive contract at some point and this provided an opportunity.

Good points above you made here - I think these are both logical reasons for both guys switching teams. thx!

But the Preds received just as massive a contract with Subban. Subban's cap hit is actually higher year-to-year by ~ 1M for the same number of years.