Official Best Offseason Ever Thread

[theohall]

Unrelated to all of that...

Chuck Fletcher continues to be a moron. The Flyers are on record saying they needed scoring help on the wing. So why did they pass on Cole Caufield, technically twice, since they traded down? The defenseman he drafted, Cameron York, probably wasn't the "best player available" while Caufield was rated as a top 10 pick and was still available at 11 and 14. Seems to me Fletcher is going to get rid of all the defenseman Hextall drafted/acquired and create his own team, instead of building on the talent already there, which will more than likely set them back, not push them into the playoffs more quickly which was the supposed reason for firing Hextall. Just waiting for the Gostisbehere trade to happen (his name has been in rumors), then he only has to move Provorov (whose name hasn't been mentioned by anyone).

Everyone today on the radio when discussing Hayes 100% agrees he was massively over-paid and that overpayment is going to screw GMs, especially with the smaller cap increase (both this year and next) unless... this is the big IF part - they are able to point to all of the other players who are better making ~2M less per season. 1 guy getting overpaid shouldn't set the market and GMs will use that by using an aggregate of similar players with similar salaries and putting some kind of average together - which will help mitigate the one ridiculous outlier. How in the heck other GMs put up with Fletcher overpaying players to that extent, I will never know. Yes, Armstrong overpaid several players, but it wasn't 2M+ over their market value.

[glen a richter]

I like our draft picks, but I'm confused why Army both felt the need to trade for another 7th round pick and to draft two goalies.

[WaukeeBlues]

I like our draft picks, but I'm confused why Army both felt the need to trade for another 7th round pick and to draft two goalies.

Well I guess technically if goalies take 5 years or so to start to be able to play in the NHL then that would mean Binnington is winding down or maybe not taking as much of the full load.

Planning for the future I guess?

It's funny, for as much as I watch the NHL draft every year and claim to have a single idea as to what I'm talking about, you can never tell with these things until like 4 years down the road minimum.

In that spirit... here's the Blues 2015 draft:

Vince Dunn, 56th overall: Home run. Boom. Good start.
Adam Musil, 94th overall: Playing for the Chicago Wolves, posted 14 points in 65 games last year. He's still under contract with the Blues for '19-'20 where, unless something drastic happens, I'd expect he's cut loose after next year.
Glenn Gawdin, 116th overall: We talked about him a bit ago. Became an "overager" in the WHL. Calgary signed him, he played for their AHL team this last season (38 points in 64 games, no NHL appearances) I guess time will tell but doesn't appear to be a miss on the Blues part.
Niko Mikkola, 127th overall: Blues signed him, he jumped from Finland to Chicago Wolves this last season, posted 9 points in 70 games in the AHL, Blues have him for at least one more year ('19-'20). Could become an NHL player.
Luke Opilka, 146th overall: Retired from hockey, sad story as we all know.
Liam Dunda, 176th overall: No longer in the CHL looks like he's playing for "Queens University" whatever the heck that is. Blues never signed him. Not an NHL player.

Not bad! I'll take one home run every year! Ha.

If you go back one year farther, 2014, Armstrong was in rare form with the names being highlights:
Robby Fabbri, Ivan Barbashev and Sammy Blais with some remaining "maybes" for Jake Walman and hopefully Ville Husso.

[glen a richter]

I was surprised by the lack of defenseman picked on Army's part. I guess the conventional wisdom within the organization is that down the road the replacements for Bouw, Gunnarsson and possibly Edmundson are already in the system in the form of Mikkola, Perunovich, Tucker, Reinke and possibly Walman.

I like the kid they took in the second round, the German born Russian dude, Alexandrov. In maybe 3 or 4 years they can probably pencil him in as a 3rd line center, maybe put him on a line with German born Swede Dominik Bokk. It's all a crapshoot now, obviously as is basically everything that far down the draft. I just thought it was strange to trade a 7th rounder next year for a 7th rounder this year and use that on a second goalie for a team which already has Husso, Fitzpatrick, Hofer and now Ellis in the system and Binnington obviously if he proves not to be a one season wonder, possibly as the goalie for the next decade. I guess once you're all the way down to the 7th then 99.9% of the time it's "who cares" picks anyway.

Also, WRT the 2014 draft, Army did have a lot of hits there but even then I remember either thinking or hearing them say in commentary that Fabbri was small and fragile and that it was a risky pick which it's proven to be. If we look in hindsight at who was still on the board when Fabbri was picked, we could have had David Pastrnak instead.

[theohall]

The goalies the Blues drafted won't even see the AHL or ECHL until the 22-23 season at the earliest. As to not drafting defenseman, the Blues have a clear top 5 for more than 3 years, minimum after Edmundson signs, already on the NHL roster. Bouwmeester retires after 19-20. Bortuzzo is only 29 and keeps signing very cap friendly deals providing a relatively stable 6th/7th defenseman. So I can see Bortuzzo sticking around for awhile in that role, essentially leaving 1 top 6 role to fill within the next 2 years, and a 7th/8th role to fill in 3-4, which the Blues have successfully filled in the past via very reasonable trades. With the Blues finally trying to create stability for development at the AHL level, only 2 guys really need to be promotable over the next 2 seasons, which would avoid the trade option. IMO, considering the number of picks available and where the Blues were drafting, they probably just did BPA from their scouting data and the late round trade is likely due to wanting the one guy for some reason we won't ever know, unless he actually makes it to the NHL.

Heck, the Blues won the Cup and have the potential to return the entire roster, or at worst (not considering what happens with Allen), lose 2 players to free agency, which means the majority of the existing prospects are still going to be developing as prospects.

[glen a richter]

I'm surprised they didn't move Allen at the draft, though I'm sure there were conversations about him. I guess more likely they either retain his services or trade him in September if/when someone goes down and a team comes calling for a serviceable replacement.

I still think it would be a whole lot easier to retain all the important RFA's if they could get rid of Allen's contract so it would be better to move him now than wait until September/October.

[WaukeeBlues]

I'm surprised they didn't move Allen at the draft, though I'm sure there were conversations about him. I guess more likely they either retain his services or trade him in September if/when someone goes down and a team comes calling for a serviceable replacement.

I still think it would be a whole lot easier to retain all the important RFA's if they could get rid of Allen's contract so it would be better to move him now than wait until September/October.

If I had to guess it's a matter of how much of Allen's salary the Blues would be willing to retain in a trade. It'd be a hefty price to get a team to eat the whole contract. Also, unfortunately, the market has a glut of goaltenders (Carolina announcing they're not bringing back either of Mrazek or McElhenniy (sp), Lehner, Mike Smith, Cam Ward, Semyon Varlamov, Talbot, Neuvirth, Elliott), and a lot of teams are already set in goal.

Might be way easier said than done to get Allen moved. Assuming that Army in fact wants to do that. A case can be made for keeping him on as a veteran backup for Binnington.

[theohall]

Even with Allen still on the team, I don't see the Blues having a problem signing all of the RFAs, IF Gunnarson and/or Maroon aren't re-signed. I really don't expect either of those two to still be with the Blues after July 1st, but you never know. The 20-21 season, when Schenn, Pietrangelo and Dunn are up for new contracts will be more of a problem if Allen is still on the Blues cap.

[glen a richter]

This has literally (likely) nothing at all to do with hockey... I got some hate mail from the department of water because I haven't done my backflow test yet, so I'm looking at the list of people on the back of the letter and notice that one of the licensed testers is a C. McAvoy in Long Beach. I wonder if they're related to Stanley Cup loser Charlie McAvoy, also from Long Beach, and if so would it be in poor taste to call them and ask? I'm almost 100% positive it's probably his dad because I looked up full names and he's Charles P. McAvoy. Charlie McAvoy is Charles Patrick.

[JCShutout]

I agree w theo. The blues can resign their rfas this year with Allen on the books. In fact, you probably don't want to move him until binner is locked up. Trade or buyout next year if you can't move him this year.

[theohall]

Article on Larry Robinson and his thoughts about Berube and Van Ryn this season: Larry Robinson has high praise for Blues coach Craig Berube

A qoute which stood out to me:

Robinson was very impressed with how Van Ryn handled the defence. “He works with those guys every day and he just did a terrific job,” Robinson said. “Mike and I talk a lot and we have the same philosophies. We’re both excited for next year to come and start with these guys from Square 1 because we introduced a lot of different things that these guys haven’t had before in how to play defence, use of the stick and angles and all that kind of stuff. He’s already got stuff written down for next year for training camp and we’re looking forward to getting the guys from Day 1. They’re good right now, but I think we can make them even better.”

Which seems to tell me Yeo didn't let Van Ryn do his damn job from Day 1 last season.

[WaukeeBlues]

Article on Larry Robinson and his thoughts about Berube and Van Ryn this season: Larry Robinson has high praise for Blues coach Craig Berube

A qoute which stood out to me:

Robinson was very impressed with how Van Ryn handled the defence. “He works with those guys every day and he just did a terrific job,” Robinson said. “Mike and I talk a lot and we have the same philosophies. We’re both excited for next year to come and start with these guys from Square 1 because we introduced a lot of different things that these guys haven’t had before in how to play defence, use of the stick and angles and all that kind of stuff. He’s already got stuff written down for next year for training camp and we’re looking forward to getting the guys from Day 1. They’re good right now, but I think we can make them even better.”

Which seems to tell me Yeo didn't let Van Ryn do his damn job from Day 1 last season.

Sounds like you're right.

I honestly wonder what Yeo thinks about all this? Does he just chalk it up to Binnington and thinks he's a great coach still or has he eaten a piece of humble pie and is really self-examining his coaching practices?

[theohall]

What I'm finding really funny about Philly, where Vigneault and Yeo are both now coaching... Both of them aren't known for working well with younger players and every trade Fletcher has made this off-season has replaced a younger player with an older one. Last season, Simmonds for Hartman and a draft pick got them younger, but then he turns around and trades Hartman for Pitlick, whose older than Hartman, but has considerably less experience in terms of NHL games played. It's like Fletcher can't help himself when it comes to players under 25... they just have to go.... And if he thinks Tyler Pitlick is going to be their equivalent of what Tyler Bozak did for the Blues, he's sadly mistaken.

[JCShutout]

Would Karlsson's new 5.9m/yr be a good rough comp for Schenn next year? both had similar point totals to each other the last couple of years.

If so, sign me up for a long extension for Schenner. (Not 8 years though. 5?)

[glen a richter]

Article on Larry Robinson and his thoughts about Berube and Van Ryn this season: Larry Robinson has high praise for Blues coach Craig Berube

A qoute which stood out to me:

Robinson was very impressed with how Van Ryn handled the defence. “He works with those guys every day and he just did a terrific job,” Robinson said. “Mike and I talk a lot and we have the same philosophies. We’re both excited for next year to come and start with these guys from Square 1 because we introduced a lot of different things that these guys haven’t had before in how to play defence, use of the stick and angles and all that kind of stuff. He’s already got stuff written down for next year for training camp and we’re looking forward to getting the guys from Day 1. They’re good right now, but I think we can make them even better.”

Which seems to tell me Yeo didn't let Van Ryn do his damn job from Day 1 last season.

Sounds like you're right.

I honestly wonder what Yeo thinks about all this? Does he just chalk it up to Binnington and thinks he's a great coach still or has he eaten a piece of humble pie and is really self-examining his coaching practices?

if Yeo was still the coach, Binnington wouldn't even be in our vocabulary. He would have ridden Allen all the way to probably about 28th in the league. Ol' Mikey is probably just about pompous enough to actually believe it was pure luck and had nothing to do with the coaching change that the Blues won. What would serve him well is some time assistant coaching at the college level and learning how to work with young players. Funny that he made his name, mainly, as an assistant coach in Pittsburgh and had this amazing power play. I could have coached that team to a #1 overall power play given the players, and my experience extends as far as playing pick up roller hockey with my buddies a few days a week in the summers 20-25 years ago when my legs still worked relatively well.

I wonder if when the DVD comes out, will there be any mention of Yeo or will they just skip to the parts and the people who actually matter?

[StL Dan]

It's been a lot fun bouncing around the internet to various NHL related sites like Wiki, NHL.com, sporcle and others and seeing all of them updated with St. Louis Blues SC Champions info.

Very satisfying.

[WaukeeBlues]

Would Karlsson's new 5.9m/yr be a good rough comp for Schenn next year? both had similar point totals to each other the last couple of years.

If so, sign me up for a long extension for Schenner. (Not 8 years though. 5?)

I think $6/per is fair for him but he'll probably try to push it to $7+

First off, Schenn has a longer and more impressive resume than Karlsson, to which he can now add "significant contributor in Stanley Cup title" to. There were plenty of nights he was one of the Blues best players this playoff run, just couldn't get the d**n puck in the net. He was snakebit, yea, but played really well.

Second, he'll be sure to point to Kevin Hayes, and Schenn is better, and "the cap keeps going up!" argument that the players constantly make.

He'll turn 29 right before the 2020-2021 season starts. I have no doubt in the slightest he'll want the full 8 years. All of them do. Blues probably want 3-4 years if they're smart. I wouldn't be mad about a 5 year deal but we're increasingly getting to the point where GM's better figure out PDQ that contracts for most players after 30 is just a waste, especially at forward.

I don't know how many times GM's have to get burned on ridiculous contracts going into a guy's age 34+ plus before the market stops doing it but apparently the answer is "not yet." Pietrangelo will likely want 8 years too. That's concerning as well.

I would be a terrible GM. If any player wanted a 5+ year contract going past age 33 I'd tell them to walk.

[JCShutout]

Yeah. I want 4 years on Schenn, but will take 5. I'd even pay him up to $6.5m. I think he's a vital part of the window we have open right now. Petro will be tough call. I'd do 5 years (prefer 4) at Tank money knowing the last couple won't be great, but the window is now and I'll bet those first 3 will be worth it.

So basically I'd be a terrible GM, because I'm sure Petro argues for $9m or something crazy.

[glen a richter]

Between the guys on roster now, the guys in the pipeline from the past few drafts and the expansion draft in a couple of years, I could see some turnover that we don't want to see come next year or year after. In particular I don't think both Schenn and Pietrangelo will end their careers with the Blues. Maybe one or the other but I really don't know. Winning teams make money but the cap is the cap even if the owner is a multi-zillionaire. Right now, keep as much of the band together as financially possible and try to kick big decisions down the road when the San Antonio crew has had another full year together and some of the recent draft picks have had another year to grow--your Bokk's and your Perunovich's, those guys.

[WaukeeBlues]

Yea this group is the "window" from the rebuild that began in 2005.

THANKFULLY, we got a f****ing Stanley Cup from that rebuild

... so really this is all just gravy with this group at this point. If we happen to win another one, phenomenal! But yea, here in about 4ish years it might be "tear down" time and the boys that we'll never forget will start getting traded, move on via free agency, retire, etc. It'll be sad when we get there, but HEY! We won a cup I'm trying to revel in it this summer as much as possible