GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby DaDitka » Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:26 am

SIU LAW wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:Sign Alex Steen now.


I like Steen, but I think he is a good player that seems destined to be overpaid.



I was thinking the exact same thing this morning.

Last year I couldn’t replace him fast enough, this year we can’t resign him fast enough.

He’s a 14 goal a year guy, if he’s willing to be paid as such then I’d be interested.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby dmiles2186 » Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:36 am

DaDitka wrote:
SIU LAW wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:Sign Alex Steen now.


I like Steen, but I think he is a good player that seems destined to be overpaid.



I was thinking the exact same thing this morning.

Last year I couldn’t replace him fast enough, this year we can’t resign him fast enough.

He’s a 14 goal a year guy, if he’s willing to be paid as such then I’d be interested.


That's sort of my point. Sign him now before he hits the market and drives up his value. Steen played very well at the end of last year, and I thought he was one of our better players in the playoffs against the 'Nucks last year. He was everywhere, flying around, hitting people, consistently putting shots on net. That's carried over into this year. He's been valuable on the PK, he and Jay seem to play well together, and now he's been playing the PP the last few games and has made things happen.

I get that he may be overpaid, but if we can get him at a decent salary, I'd love to have him back. But if he's asking for 4 mil a year, as much as I'd hate to see him go, there's no one in their right mind that should pay that much at this time for Alexander Steen, the Steen Engine, as he was dubbed in flashchat last night.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby DaDitka » Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:59 am

dmiles2186 wrote:That's sort of my point. Sign him now before he hits the market and drives up his value. Steen played very well at the end of last year, and I thought he was one of our better players in the playoffs against the 'Nucks last year. He was everywhere, flying around, hitting people, consistently putting shots on net. That's carried over into this year. He's been valuable on the PK, he and Jay seem to play well together, and now he's been playing the PP the last few games and has made things happen.

I get that he may be overpaid, but if we can get him at a decent salary, I'd love to have him back. But if he's asking for 4 mil a year, as much as I'd hate to see him go, there's no one in their right mind that should pay that much at this time for Alexander Steen, the Steen Engine, as he was dubbed in flashchat last night.



Don't you wish he had one more year left on his deal so we could find out who the 'real' Steen is.

Funny you mentioned the 4 million dollar mark, I was referencing that as well or more particular the Boyes deal. That's too much for Alex. Problem is he’s currently making 1.7 a year and probably looking for a considerable raise. When you consider that guys like Winchester and Crombeen aren’t even getting a mill/year, Backes is getting 2.5 and Walt’s only getting 2.1, it’s tough to rationalize giving Steen much of a raise at all. Would he consider a 3 year deal for 6 mill? I doubt it.

My first thought was a 3 yr / 7mill deal, but after looking at everyone else’s contracts, I just can’t see going a penny over 2 mill a year.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby JWatt (formerly PMS) » Wed Jan 13, 2010 10:01 am

Steen is not good enough to get an offer sheet thrown his way. He'll have to settle for what the Blues give him. IMO, that will be about $2MM/yr.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby dmiles2186 » Wed Jan 13, 2010 11:06 am

DaDitka wrote:
dmiles2186 wrote:That's sort of my point. Sign him now before he hits the market and drives up his value. Steen played very well at the end of last year, and I thought he was one of our better players in the playoffs against the 'Nucks last year. He was everywhere, flying around, hitting people, consistently putting shots on net. That's carried over into this year. He's been valuable on the PK, he and Jay seem to play well together, and now he's been playing the PP the last few games and has made things happen.

I get that he may be overpaid, but if we can get him at a decent salary, I'd love to have him back. But if he's asking for 4 mil a year, as much as I'd hate to see him go, there's no one in their right mind that should pay that much at this time for Alexander Steen, the Steen Engine, as he was dubbed in flashchat last night.



Don't you wish he had one more year left on his deal so we could find out who the 'real' Steen is.


I do, but he was traded from a pressure cooker in Toronto last year to St. Louis. You could tell once he felt more comfortable in his new surroundings he opened up a bit. I guess if I had to put a number on it, 2 mil would be my hopeful salary for him. Then again, we all thought Backes' deal at 2.5 was expensive until he went out and scored 31 goals last year.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby Wulfen » Wed Jan 13, 2010 12:05 pm

1.8 to 2.2 is a good range for Steen. He is solid in all aspects of the game. But we cant overpay for him because we have Johnson and Perron due up for contracts this offseason and those 2 should be top priority.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby BoxCar » Wed Jan 13, 2010 12:12 pm

I've been a huge fan of Steen (and Colaiacovo for that matter) since the trade. This is the exact type of player that teams need to go far into the playoffs. He is a consistent positive for the team; whether it is his speed, passing, point management, defense or physical play. He is basically fundamental hockey to a T. Also- he cares out there, I saw the determination in his eyes last night when they lined up for a faceoff in front of Mason (right before Steen iced the game). Now I'm sure I would have traded 1 for 1 Stempniak for Steen.

2mil a year would be a great price for him. 2.5 for Backes (30 goals or not) is also an amazing price.

Watching last night's game in person was amazing. We have many great young players that may not score 50 goals a year, but who play solid hockey. I think we are one established sniper and an offensive dman away from contention in next year and beyond.

Also, Brewer seems to have grown balls recently. He was crushing people in the defensive zone and sticking up for Mason as soon as a Blue Jacket even thought about getting in his face. He was also upended by Picard while trying to skate over him after punishing him.

I think Cam proved his and my point last night. That fight (and string of fights that followed) really got the crowd pumped.

Is David Backes on a mission to fight the best players from every team? Toews, Nash, Perry. Lovin' it!
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby WaukeeBlues » Wed Jan 13, 2010 1:36 pm

Wulfen wrote:1.8 to 2.2 is a good range for Steen. He is solid in all aspects of the game. But we cant overpay for him because we have Johnson and Perron due up for contracts this offseason and those 2 should be top priority.


ELEVENTY YEERS @ $9019059!!!!1!!!1!1!!!

But seriously I agree.

If there were any 2 guys on the roster that were to get one of those outrageous 13 year contracts, I'd pick EJ and Perron. Don't think it'll happen though, they haven't established themselves enough yet to warrant over-paying annually so as to save in the cap hit. The amount per year shouldn't be that high. YET.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby WaukeeBlues » Wed Jan 13, 2010 1:40 pm

BoxCar wrote:Is David Backes on a mission to fight the best players from every team? Toews, Nash, Perry. Lovin' it!


Nash doesn't shock me but Toews and Perry definitely did. Backes manhandled both of 'em too. :okman:
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby DaDitka » Wed Jan 13, 2010 3:33 pm

BoxCar wrote:I think Cam proved his and my point last night. That fight (and string of fights that followed) really got the crowd pumped.


Dude, this isn't the WWE. It's not theater either. It's a competitive sport and it's about wins and losses.

You're right, everyone loves a good fight (especially me), but that is not what the game is about and my point is that Cam brings nothing else to the table. Crombeen, Whinchester, Backas, all drop the gloves but they also contribute so much more.

You're defense about Cam's limited ice time is weak too. I'm supposed to feel better because we waste an active spot on the roster for a guy who won't even see the ice but for 3 minutes?

Hell if it's all about the crowd, why not throw a line-up of Louie, Black-kid-dancing, and Angelia up front, with Cotton-eye-Joe and that umpa-lumpa that plays the organ on defense. Then let Cam play goal without his shirt on and you'll have a jolly good time.

We appear to be talking about two completely different things. Yes, the crowd loves Cam, but I assure you opponent love to see his name in the line up as well because that one less threat we have on the ice and that even more time that we'll have to skate our other guys risking fatigue in the third and especially OT.

There is a place in hockey for fighting, but today’s rules means being a fighter doesn’t make you a hockey player. Back in the day when if you go your stick up on Al or Brett, Twist would come across those boards and hurt you…..you just can’t do that anymore. Cam can not make people pay, he doesn’t invoke fear in the other team, and he can’t play hockey. Hell, everything we read in the preseason said that the team preferred King to Cam and most did not expect Cam to spend the season in St. Louis. I’m merely stating that even another Crombeen or Whinchester would do much more good for the team then skating Cam. They can still have him meat the Great-Clips fan of the game and he can do public appearances, but until we’re mathematically eliminated from the playoffs I’d rather he be watching from the rafters like me.

Cam’s act is better suited for minor league hockey where you need a shtick to help sell tickets, but he is a hell of a guy though.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby DaDitka » Wed Jan 13, 2010 3:42 pm

WaukeeBlues wrote:If there were any 2 guys on the roster that were to get one of those outrageous 13 year contracts, I'd pick EJ and Perron. Don't think it'll happen though, they haven't established themselves enough yet to warrant over-paying annually so as to save in the cap hit. The amount per year shouldn't be that high. YET.



I think EJ's deal will be real interesting. I could really see a short term deal for mid level money so there we would have to readdress it in a couple of years when he may merit top end money.

We did him a favor paying him last year. I don’t expect him to cut us a deal because of it, but agree to a short term deal like that would prove beneficial to both sides and in all honesty result in more total dollars for EJ when he finally does reach his potential.

David on the other hand, if he doesn’t have a huge second half, he’ll have three straight 15 goalish seasons and that’s a fair barometer to base a 3 or 4 year deal on. I’m sure he’ll what it as short as possible so that he can raise his numbers and hopefully his pay and we’ll obviously try pushing for more years so that hopefully we’re getting a it of a deal if he blossoms to be more then a 15 to 20 goal guy.


If you go three years with each of these two, we should still own their rights when that contract expires. Sure you risk having to break the bank, but you’re not risking getting burned if one of them doesn’t become the player you believe they can become.

That said, I’m thinking a two year deal on EJ. Who knows?
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby section319 » Wed Jan 13, 2010 4:19 pm

I don't think Steens gonna command a big contract he will get whatever the Blues give him.

And as far as Cam, who are you going to replace him with that's gonna bring more. You can downgrade geting the fans pumped all you want but it is a factor and him being from St. Louis is a factor for the fans. Armstrong isn't bringing anything Cam doesn't and he isn't a crowd favorite. With the shit season we have had this season at least let the fans see Cam if they want, there's a reason people had "Let Cam play" signs at games last year.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby thedoc » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:18 pm

If your going to use the he is from St. Louis argument you could bring Stastny up. He offers more than Cam and he grew up here as well.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby philco_3 » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:19 pm

DaDitka wrote:
BoxCar wrote:I think Cam proved his and my point last night. That fight (and string of fights that followed) really got the crowd pumped.


Dude, this isn't the WWE. It's not theater either. It's a competitive sport and it's about wins and losses.

You're right, everyone loves a good fight (especially me), but that is not what the game is about and my point is that Cam brings nothing else to the table. Crombeen, Whinchester, Backas, all drop the gloves but they also contribute so much more.

You're defense about Cam's limited ice time is weak too. I'm supposed to feel better because we waste an active spot on the roster for a guy who won't even see the ice but for 3 minutes?

Hell if it's all about the crowd, why not throw a line-up of Louie, Black-kid-dancing, and Angelia up front, with Cotton-eye-Joe and that umpa-lumpa that plays the organ on defense. Then let Cam play goal without his shirt on and you'll have a jolly good time.

We appear to be talking about two completely different things. Yes, the crowd loves Cam, but I assure you opponent love to see his name in the line up as well because that one less threat we have on the ice and that even more time that we'll have to skate our other guys risking fatigue in the third and especially OT.

There is a place in hockey for fighting, but today’s rules means being a fighter doesn’t make you a hockey player. Back in the day when if you go your stick up on Al or Brett, Twist would come across those boards and hurt you…..you just can’t do that anymore. Cam can not make people pay, he doesn’t invoke fear in the other team, and he can’t play hockey. Hell, everything we read in the preseason said that the team preferred King to Cam and most did not expect Cam to spend the season in St. Louis. I’m merely stating that even another Crombeen or Whinchester would do much more good for the team then skating Cam. They can still have him meat the Great-Clips fan of the game and he can do public appearances, but until we’re mathematically eliminated from the playoffs I’d rather he be watching from the rafters like me.

Cam’s act is better suited for minor league hockey where you need a shtick to help sell tickets, but he is a hell of a guy though.


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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby glen a richter » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:19 pm

section319 wrote:there's a reason people had "Let Cam play" signs at games last year.


And that reason is that they're totally clueless and think it's sane to dress a guy whose sole purpose is to go on the ice to fight one staged fight and then warm the bench the rest of the evening. He's not protecting anyone. He's not contributing a damn thing offensively. He's fighting a staged fight against the other teams designated fighter which ultimately brings jack shit to the table.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby goon attack » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:35 pm

you fookin' pansies make me SICK.

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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby section319 » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:42 pm

But Stastny isn't a crowd favorite like Cam is, I'm not saying it's the only reason but people do like that.

And with the exception of the past two games Winchester and Crombeen don't bring much offensive upside either, I'm not saying they're on the same level but still. We aren't going to roll 4 skilled, scoring lines. I can't believe this many people are concerned about the one roster spot he's taking up, like if we were playing Armstrog over Cam we'd be in a play off spot. The coaches on most teams feel the need to have a Janssen type player on their team, get over it.

And the comment about the signs I didn't say they were knowledgable fans, I said he is a crowd favorite and the signs was my example of that. Give the fans what they want, we have a Blue bear mascot, Janssen maybe a mascot on the ice at best but the fans love him. I would rather have thecrowd excited when Janssen gets on the ice than the no reaction to Armstrong, Cam doesn't even have to do anything the fans just pay attention to him.

All this talk about how Winchester and Crombeen care so much when they are out there, but I don't think Janssen ever lacks caring, he grew up a Blues fan and cares more than anyone out on the ice.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby glen a richter » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:44 pm

Christ, goon. I don't think we're making an argument to end fighting in hockey. I think we're making the argument that a staged fight serves no practical purpose. Cam is one-dimensional. He goes on the ice to get into a fight and then that's it for the night. He contributes nothing offensively, he's not really being anyone's bodyguard, his whole reason for being on the team is a complete mystery.

Replace him with a guy who will both fight to protect the teams better players and contribute something on the scoresheet other than 5 PIM and 3 minutes TOI and then we're talking someone who actually justifies dressing every game.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby section319 » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:46 pm

But Stastny isn't a crowd favorite like Cam is, I'm not saying it's the only reason but people do like that.

And with the exception of the past two games Winchester and Crombeen don't bring much offensive upside either, I'm not saying they're on the same level but still. We aren't going to roll 4 skilled, scoring lines. I can't believe this many people are concerned about the one roster spot he's taking up, like if we were playing Armstrog over Cam we'd be in a play off spot. The coaches on most teams feel the need to have a Janssen type player on their team, get over it.

And the comment about the signs I didn't say they were knowledgable fans, I said he is a crowd favorite and the signs was my example of that. Give the fans what they want, we have a Blue bear mascot, Janssen maybe a mascot on the ice at best but the fans love him. I would rather have thecrowd excited when Janssen gets on the ice than the no reaction to Armstrong, Cam doesn't even have to do anything the fans just pay attention to him.

All this talk about how Winchester and Crombeen care so much when they are out there, but I don't think Janssen ever lacks caring, he grew up a Blues fan and cares more than anyone out on the ice.
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Re: GDT: Columbus @ St. Louis -- 7pm -- FSMW & KMOX

Postby glen a richter » Wed Jan 13, 2010 5:47 pm

section319 wrote: I would rather have thecrowd excited when Janssen gets on the ice than the no reaction to Armstrong, Cam doesn't even have to do anything the fans just pay attention to him.


I would rather have the crowd excited when the team wins games and gets deep in the playoffs than they get excited because they got to see Cam get into a scrap with a designated fighter and take a penalty worth more minutes than his total TOI for the entire night.

That also means no Armstrong.
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