World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

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World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby dmiles2186 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:04 am

Cards have home field and Carp going in Game 1. On paper, Texas looks outstanding and like they should probably win the Series.

Hard to believe we're talking Cards in the Series after where they were 2 months ago. Either way, it should be a fun 4-7 games.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby cardsfan04 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:08 am

I feel like we just played our WS, so I'm not that confident. But, I'm learning not to pick against this team. We should crush the ball in Arlington.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:33 am

Actually it doesn't sound like Carp is going to be ready for game one. I know Little Dunk is talking about holding him out until game three.

We'll have to wait and see, but supposedly the inflammation and discomfort is pretty bad in that elbow.

They said that if the LDS would have gone to game 7 he would not have pitched.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby cardsfan04 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 7:43 am

I was under the impression that the elbow soreness was overblown a bit. It looks to me like a ~non-story that the media is trying to milk every bit of.

I found these two paragraphs from an article posted on a Cards forum:

Mozeliak, La Russa and Carpenter took turns Sunday night insisting that Carpenter's right elbow is not an issue and that he would have started Game 7 against the Brewers if the Cards had failed to clinch. La Russa challenged a description of Carpenter being "sore" following his five-inning start in Game 3 while Carpenter dismissed a question during Sunday's celebration regarding concern about his right elbow.


Duncan did not address Carpenter's health Monday except to say he believes the pitcher is well-positioned to start Wednesday's opener. Others noted Carpenter's condition had improved significantly in the last 48 hours. Still, any possibility of Carpenter appearing on short rest as he did in the NL division series against the Philadelphia Phillies appears to have evaporated.


Ultimately, I can't imagine anybody taking the ball out of Carp's hand before game 1 of the World Series. I just don't see it happening.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:32 am

cardsfan04 wrote:I was under the impression that the elbow soreness was overblown a bit. It looks to me like a ~non-story that the media is trying to milk every bit of.



You're right, what the hell would the pitching coach's son know?

Oh, and Tony himself 'implied' that Carp would not have stated game 7....so the issues IS A BIG DEAL.

But, what ever helps you sleep at night.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:32 am

cardsfan04 wrote:I was under the impression that the elbow soreness was overblown a bit. It looks to me like a ~non-story that the media is trying to milk every bit of.



You're right, what the hell would the pitching coach's son know?

Oh, and Tony himself 'implied' that Carp would not have stated game 7....so the issues IS A BIG DEAL.

But, what ever helps you sleep at night.



Don't get me wrong, I'd love for you to be right.....you're just not.

Even if he starts he won't be 100% and if he goes long it probably rules him out of a second start in the series anyways.

That's their thinking, he's probably only good for one start, so why not make sure he's as healthy as possible (according to Dunk)
Last edited by DaDitka on Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby dmiles2186 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:47 am

To be honest, I hadn't even really heard of an elbow issue. There was talk of Carp throwing Games 1, 4 and 7 in the WS if needed. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.

The one good thing the Cardinals have is that on paper they are the most AL-esque lineup in the National League. Granted, the Rangers are STACKED, but if you take away their DH and make their pitcher hit, that could lead to someone like Michael Young playing 1B to get in the lineup and sitting Mooreland.

On the flip side, when the Cards go to Texas, do you start Craig in left field and move Holliday to DH? Or do you use Freese as DH and Descalso at 3B for defense? I'd say the first option leads to a stronger lineup but La Russa will have some fun tinkering with that I'm sure.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:51 am

dmiles2186 wrote:To be honest, I hadn't even really heard of an elbow issue. There was talk of Carp throwing Games 1, 4 and 7 in the WS if needed. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.



It broke yesterday with Joe Strauss, and Duncan talked about it extensively on the radio yesterday.

Tony made light of it in the locker room right after the win when he said "Let's just say we I'm glad we won it tonight". Because they were not going to pitch Carp in game 7.(again, according to (Lil) Duncan.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby cardsfan04 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:02 am

I really like Chris Duncan as a radio guy. Very fun to listen to. But, I'll take Mo, TLR, and big Dunc's word over his. They could be downplaying it. OR, it could be that the issue really isn't that big.

As for the DH, Holliday/Berkman as DH and Craig in the field. Craig's bat >>>>>>>>>>> Descalso's glove.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:06 am

cardsfan04 wrote:But, I'll take Mo, TLR, and big Dunc's word over his..



Then you have A LOT TO LEARN. :facepalm:

The last thing you ever do is listen to someone that works for the team.

The Cards brass doesn't want to let the Rangers know anything and they gain nothing by being honest with you.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby cardsfan04 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:11 am

DaDitka wrote:
cardsfan04 wrote:But, I'll take Mo, TLR, and big Dunc's word over his..



Then you have A LOT TO LEARN. :facepalm:

The last thing you ever do is listen to someone that works for the team.

The Cards brass doesn't want to let the Rangers know anything and they gain nothing by being honest with you.


And, I agree with that. But, by the same logic, somebody who works for the team had to be the origin of the rumor. So, it begs the question, "were they being honest when they leaked the rumor or are they being honest when they say there's nothing to it?"

Bottom line, we really don't know all that much. And, even though lil Dunc is the PC's son, I don't think he would give inside info away on air. Surely him and his dad have worked that out by now.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:33 am

cardsfan04 wrote:Bottom line, we really don't know all that much. And, even though lil Dunc is the PC's son, I don't think he would give inside info away on air. Surely him and his dad have worked that out by now.



Agreed. The basic premise was 'do you start Carp at 70% in game one and risk him being done for the series or hope he's 100% for game 3 but then you are really risking his availability for a second start because you would expect inflammation again.'

I'm not sure there is an easy, answer there.

Carp has been bad in two of his last three starts, the beat writer and the PC's son says there is a problem....there's a problem.

Don't get me wrong, he very well may start game one and give us 7 solid.....but that doesn't mean they aren't concerned about his elbow right now.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby cardsfan04 » Tue Oct 18, 2011 9:43 am

I agree there is probably concern. These things don't just come out of nowhere w/o a basis in fact. I'm just not buying into the sky is falling mentality that the media seems to want to portray. And, if Carp can go tomorrow night, it's nonsensical to move him back. So what if there's the risk that he only gets one start because of it? The same risk is even bigger by moving him back to game 3, meaning he couldn't go until game 6 on short rest or game 7 on full rest. I'll take my chances that he doesn't get hurt in game 1 every single time.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:05 am

cardsfan04 wrote:. And, if Carp can go tomorrow night, it's nonsensical to move him back.


Again..the question is 70% Carp in game one or 100% Carp in game three (the way I understand it).

As for the Media's 'sky is falling' I hadn't heard that, but I agree that is a sever overreaction.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby Leedog » Tue Oct 18, 2011 3:05 pm

All I can say is bet on the Rangers in game 2. The Cards have played 5 home post season games. I have gone to 2. They are 3-0 with me at home, 0-2 with me there. Guess who just got a ticket to game 2.....
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Tue Oct 18, 2011 8:21 pm

Leedog wrote:All I can say is bet on the Rangers in game 2. The Cards have played 5 home post season games. I have gone to 2. They are 3-0 with me at home, 0-2 with me there. Guess who just got a ticket to game 2.....


At least you picked a game with Garcia pitching.

Oh, and note...the Cardinal announced today that they are adding Jake Westbrook to the World Series. I wonder what would prompt them to do that?
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby cardsfan04 » Wed Oct 19, 2011 12:20 am

DaDitka wrote:
Leedog wrote:All I can say is bet on the Rangers in game 2. The Cards have played 5 home post season games. I have gone to 2. They are 3-0 with me at home, 0-2 with me there. Guess who just got a ticket to game 2.....


At least you picked a game with Garcia pitching.

Oh, and note...the Cardinal announced today that they are adding Jake Westbrook to the World Series. I wonder what would prompt them to do that?


McClellan is extremely ineffective (why was he even on the NLCS roster?, sigh). Groundball pitchers usually have much better success in Arlington than flyball pitchers. I'm not sure I like it, but I'm sure that's the rationale.

Also, back on the Carp topic, I was listening to Dunc's show on 101 today and they played a sound bite of Carp discussing the injury. He basically said, "It's October. Every ballplayer has aches and pains at this time of year after a long season. I pitched 200+ innings and this year and 4000+ pitches. I was sore after my last start, but am in no way injured."

Now, obviously that's kinda what you expect him to say. But, it made me feel a little bit better hearing him say it w/ as much conviction as he did.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby DaDitka » Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:50 am

cardsfan04 wrote:
DaDitka wrote:
Leedog wrote:All I can say is bet on the Rangers in game 2. The Cards have played 5 home post season games. I have gone to 2. They are 3-0 with me at home, 0-2 with me there. Guess who just got a ticket to game 2.....


At least you picked a game with Garcia pitching.

Oh, and note...the Cardinal announced today that they are adding Jake Westbrook to the World Series. I wonder what would prompt them to do that?


McClellan is extremely ineffective (why was he even on the NLCS roster?, sigh). Groundball pitchers usually have much better success in Arlington than flyball pitchers. I'm not sure I like it, but I'm sure that's the rationale.

Also, back on the Carp topic, I was listening to Dunc's show on 101 today and they played a sound bite of Carp discussing the injury. He basically said, "It's October. Every ballplayer has aches and pains at this time of year after a long season. I pitched 200+ innings and this year and 4000+ pitches. I was sore after my last start, but am in no way injured."

Now, obviously that's kinda what you expect him to say. But, it made me feel a little bit better hearing him say it w/ as much conviction as he did.


Carp will pitch all seven games if you let him, and I'm not saying he's not going to pitch tonight...


I'm just saying they are honestly concerned and there is a reason for that concern. Hopefully Carp goes out and defies reason again, it certainly wouldn't be the first. Dude is a stud. I just don't want the team running him out there if they don't think he can do it. The last thing we need to see is Carp get lit up for 5 in three, get pulled and be done for the series. It's a seven game series, he doesn't have to pitch tonight if he's not ready. If he is.......BRING IT ON!
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby cardsfan04 » Wed Oct 19, 2011 9:03 am

I agree that he shouldn't pitch if he's not ready. But, it's important to remember Joe Strauss is the guy that broke the story. I've met Joe and think he's a really good guy. But, I still take what he says w/ a grain of salt. He tends to overblow rumors so what he has to say makes news. A few weeks ago he told everybody to await a big announcement about Pujols and his contract over the weekend.
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Re: World Series: Cardinals vs Rangers

Postby dmiles2186 » Wed Oct 19, 2011 1:32 pm

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