Official Best Offseason Ever Thread

[glen a richter]

I’ve been reading some stuff about Barbie, his moron agent who’s apparently been fired by a bunch of clients including Panarin, and what some people think will happen if Barbie leaves for the K. Many of them seem to think Kostin can step into his role. Please folks, put down the crack pipe. Kostin is a flake and nowhere near ready for the NHL. I’m real tired of hearing his name bounced around as a guy who can make the team out of camp. He can’t and he won’t.

Maybe we should ask Jon Hamm what is going to happen. He seems to have a knack for calling Barbie's big scores.

I think Jon Hamm would put in more effort than Kostin. Funny, at the time of the trade I was excited for Kostin but not so much for Sundqvist, Sunny was the big ticket and Kostin was the meh of that deal. It's still a little early for my favorite game of "The Blues could have drafted "X" instead" but I'm positive that someone who went in the second round of that draft will be light years better than Kostin ever will. Oh well, we still drafted Robert Thomas, still got Sunny in the deal and still won the Cup, so water under the bridge.

[theohall]

And I still believe Toropchenko from that same draft will be a significant contributor to the Blues in a Sundqvist like role with slightly more offensive production before Kostin even gets out of the AHL. Consider this, Toropchenko is already bigger than half the Blues current forwards. He doesn't need to grow into his body any more.

[JCShutout]

To bring this full circle to the Blues that's why Pietro and Schenn really concern me. They're going to want term and we just cannot do that. Pietro especially. He's going to be 30.5 years old next summer. Unless it's like a 3 year deal I would be very concerned. He'll likely want the full 8. Ugh. I guess we'll see. Armstrong is going to have some difficult decisions to make next summer. I do not envy him.

If they really want the full 8 then sure, move on, but if they take a reasonable 5 years, then lock them up.

[theohall]

To bring this full circle to the Blues that's why Pietro and Schenn really concern me. They're going to want term and we just cannot do that. Pietro especially. He's going to be 30.5 years old next summer. Unless it's like a 3 year deal I would be very concerned. He'll likely want the full 8. Ugh. I guess we'll see. Armstrong is going to have some difficult decisions to make next summer. I do not envy him.

If they really want the full 8 then sure, move on, but if they take a reasonable 5 years, then lock them up.

[glen a richter]

This offseason is really the best! I’m learning new programs for windows and linux!

[WaukeeBlues]

I’ve been reading some stuff about Barbie, his moron agent who’s apparently been fired by a bunch of clients including Panarin, and what some people think will happen if Barbie leaves for the K. Many of them seem to think Kostin can step into his role. Please folks, put down the crack pipe. Kostin is a flake and nowhere near ready for the NHL. I’m real tired of hearing his name bounced around as a guy who can make the team out of camp. He can’t and he won’t.

Maybe we should ask Jon Hamm what is going to happen. He seems to have a knack for calling Barbie's big scores.

I think Jon Hamm would put in more effort than Kostin. Funny, at the time of the trade I was excited for Kostin but not so much for Sundqvist, Sunny was the big ticket and Kostin was the meh of that deal. It's still a little early for my favorite game of "The Blues could have drafted "X" instead" but I'm positive that someone who went in the second round of that draft will be light years better than Kostin ever will. Oh well, we still drafted Robert Thomas, still got Sunny in the deal and still won the Cup, so water under the bridge.

That's kinda where I'm at. You can argue that the last, what, 8-9 years worth of moves were all "worth it" and none of the bad ones matter. Because, HEY! We won the cup! It's almost like you wipe the slate clean and starting all over for 2019-2020, ha.

Hindsight with drafts is always a dangerous thing. These are the kids at the end of the day and outside of the top 1-2 players every year, you're rolling the dice. Sometimes you have more dice in your hand than some others, but you're still rolling them. But Nic Hague went early 2nd and Alex Textier out of Columbus are both looking like they are going to be really good players.

At the time I remember Kostin being a high risk, high reward boom/bust type prospect. All the talent in the world but serious question marks. That's come to fruition on the question marks, but it was a phenomenal move at the time no matter how you slice it.

[JCShutout]

Even with the top picks, the draft is no guarantee. Just a weighted lottery ticket. I mean, sure, more lottery tickets and you have a better chance of winning, but its no guarantee.

I liked the move and draft of Kostin at the time. High risk/high reward at a spot in the draft where its hard to find high reward guys. It may not work out, but he's also like 20 years old. Not everybody enters the NHL in a year and puts up 40 points. He transitioned from Russia, which is a hard thing to do, and in his first AHL season the farm team was a mess. (and part of last year it seemed like a mess iirc) Lets see how he pans out. He might turn into a scoring line player. He might turn out to be a supporting/role player. he might bust out. He's only 20.

[theohall]

I liked the move and draft of Kostin at the time. High risk/high reward at a spot in the draft where its hard to find high reward guys. It may not work out, but he's also like 20 years old. Not everybody enters the NHL in a year and puts up 40 points. He transitioned from Russia, which is a hard thing to do, and in his first AHL season the farm team was a mess. (and part of last year it seemed like a mess iirc) Lets see how he pans out. He might turn into a scoring line player. He might turn out to be a supporting/role player. he might bust out. He's only 20.

This is precisely why I believe Toropchenko is ahead of Kostin in terms of being ready sooner. While both are the same age, Toropchenko went through juniors and had the help junior teams provide adapting to the North American game and North American culture which has been an issue for Kostin. Also, Toropchenko was a 3rd line guy pretty much his entire time in juniors with the added PK/2nd PP unit responsibility. He was a 3rd line, PK, 2nd PP unit guy when playing for Russia's junior team also It's easier to jump up and fill a bottom 6 role when you've been playing that role for essentially the past 4 years (including before he was drafted), whereas cracking into a top 6 type role, where Kostin has been projected, is a much more difficult task. Toropchenko is pretty much what one should expect from a 4th round draft pick.

We shall see what happens. Thought it was odd that Kostin didn't join the Black Aces for the playoffs, even though he was invited. The two most recent interviews from this off-season involving Kostin seemed more upbeat than the past articles involving him.

[JCShutout]

Makes sense, and I hope you are right about Toropchenko as I expect some openings in the bottom 6 soon. (I'm expecting a Steen buyout next year, Thomas to move to a scoring line, Bozak gone in a couple of years, Barbie may be gone this year.) There is opportunity for guys in the next 1-3 years to claim a spot.

Heard occasionally on espn about moving on from Schenn. I wonder if the Blues see Thomas as a guy who can take Schenn's top6 role. I'd be sad to lose Schenn unless he wants 8 years and over $6m/y. I think 55-65 points and good defense is a reasonable expectation for him for the next few years and that's a useful guy to have around, though again, at $5-$6m/y, not kevin hayes money).

[glen a richter]

I completely understand the talk about moving on from Schenn. Free up some dough, got some kids in the pipeline who can replace him, or guys currently on roster (Thomas). As with Maroon, thanks for everything but you know it's still a business and it's still a cap league. Now if there was a provision that the Cup champion was allowed to have a one time spending spree where they could lock literally everyone up that they wanted to with no regard for the cap, then that would be a different story.

On that note... I think that would be an interesting incentive to be competitive, a floating cap that changes dependent on a team showing improvement from one season to the next, making the playoffs when they previously hadn't or winning the Cup.

[JCShutout]

Sure, but I think a guy like Schenn (again, for the right price) is the kind of guy who keeps you a contender. I could see Perron as more of a 3rd liner after this year, which would open a top6 spot for Thomas even if we resigned Schenn. I know everyone is high on Kyrou, but I'd rather have too much talent and deal from a strength than not have enough because Schenn walked, Perron got old and Kyrou never panned out.

[theohall]

Feel pretty doggone confident Perron will be left exposed for the Seattle Expansion draft. He'll be the current version of Keith Tkachuk, minus the Blues actually getting anything significant in return. Play for some other team for awhile, then come back as a UFA.

[JCShutout]

I'm sure he'll get exposed too, but I'm not sure he's taken this time. Why take him when you can take one of our talented kids. Can't protect them all.

[WaukeeBlues]

The more I look at the cap situation the more I'm convinced Edmundson is gone next year.

Use the money from him and Bouw and we can easily get Schenn and Pietro locked up if we want to.

Obviously if each of their demands is 8 years and $9 million AAV then Army's got some decisions to make. As it almost always is, it'll be up to Schenn and Pietro how badly they want to stay. If it's purely "most money most term" we may have to move on, and it'll be sad, but it may have to happen. If Pietrangelo has another good season, he can honestly argue Karlsson money. I don't think he'll get it, but he can make the argument he's in the same ballpark, WITH a Stanley Cup ring.

Bozak would be another contract we could move. $5 million AAV that was signed before we got O'Reilly. His NTC is a limited 10 team "no trade" list, only one year left once this season is done. He and Steen together free up a LOT of salary.

Just comes down to how badly we want to keep Schenn and Pietrangelo and how confident we are in the kids coming up in the system.

[glen a richter]

Seattle takes Perron for veteran leadership and Cup experience. That’s really the only reason I can come up with.

[JCShutout]

Or they take one of Sanford, Barbashev, Sundqvist, because they have cup experience, or Kyrou or Kostin for the talent.

[glen a richter]

Well hell that is true... I was thinking Perron because he’s more of a veteran and has been on both the losing and winning end. But yeah, fair enough the whole team has Cup experience now.

[theohall]

It's gonna be interesting, to say the least.

With what Barbashev is pulling with his crappy agent, he's going to find himself stuck in the KHL and at the Blues mercy if he wants to ever return to the NHL, like happened with Sobotka. I really don't get what that agent is trying to pull, considering this is Barbashev's first non-ELC contract. He isn't Point, Matthews, Marner, Tkachuk, etc. Yes, he was a valuable player in the Blues winning the Stanley Cup, but he was a valuable bottom 6 forward, which is where GMs save money by using younger players on ELCs or aging veterans on value contracts who play less minutes but can still play. Too bad his agent doesn't get this. Yes, I get trying to "get paid" but one should consider one's place also, and not blindly listen to their agent. Unless Barbashev really wants to play in Russia. If so, good for him.

As to Edmundson, he's UFA next season. Don't see him re-signing with the Blues given the past two seasons and what happens during an arbitration hearing - where the team basically tells a judge every possible reason why you deserve less money. It's going to be time to see prospects move up. I could even see the Blues trading Edmundson for a draft pick to someone in need this season, depending on what happens. IMO, Armstrong has been good the past few years in how the Blues handled soon to be UFAs (when to hold - Backes; when to sell - Shattenkirk, Stastny).

[glen a richter]

I’m almost at the point that I don’t care. Maroon is gone, Barbie (well his agent) is being a hardball playing dick. Whatever. I trust Berube to get Kyrou, MacEachern, Blais, etc... to buy in. We’re talking about bottom 6 players here. Berube made a career out of being a bottom 6 player, he knows what to do and we just move on. So be it.

[WaukeeBlues]

I know players don't like to do this but Barbashev may have to step in here and tell his agent to get the thing done. Assuming, of course, he wants to stay in St. Louis.

One thing I don't get with NHL players that you hear at their pressers (Marner just said this recently at his golf outing a few weeks back) a lot is "I haven't heard anything" about the negotiations for their contracts. Seriously? "I haven't heard anything."? This is arguably the most important summer of your life and you're letting your agent just control EVERYTHING to the point you're not even participating in the negotiations or process? Or are the players just flat lying?

That just absolutely baffles me. I get it, their young guys(/kids) without the savvy of someone who's "in the business" but for f**k sake, you have an opinion as to where you want to be, for how long, and for roughly how much money. How in the h**l would you not be intimately involved with your agent and the team trying to work a deal getting done?

Do these agents just come to them and be like "I accepted this on your behalf, sign here"?